House Special Committee on Act 279 Working Group

Good morning. I'd like to call order our Act 279 working group informational briefing for Monday, December 1st. It is 10:06 AM and we're grabbing room 309 and we're also streaming live on YouTube. We—members here today, we have Representative Kila here today, Representative Marten. We have Representative Poepoe, I believe on Zoom, from the island of Olukai, and we may have other members coming in throughout the info briefing.

We just have a single item on our agenda which is the info briefing from the Department today. Before we dive into that, just a quick primer background on why we're here today. Pursuing the House Resolution 10 in 2023 and HR 147 in 2025, the Legislature established the Act 279 Working Group to provide ongoing oversight of the DHL execution of the $600 million appropriated under Act 279.

That historic appropriation in 2022 was intended to significantly reduce the Homestead waitlist and the House recognized the need for structured legislative monitoring as these funds are deployed.

Since its formation, the Work Group has convened numerous public meetings to receive updates from DHHL on expenditures, project development, and progress towards meeting the goals of Act 279.

Our role as a Committee is to ensure transparency and identify any issues that may warrant legislative action and keep both the Legislature and the public informed. As we approach the conclusion of our work, we are responsible for submitting a progress report to the House prior to the 2026 regular session and a final report prior to 2027 regular session.

Today's resolution from DHL will help us complete that mandate and I really want to thank the Department for being here. Chair Watson...others from the Department who are here today, also members of the Working Group who have been engaged throughout this project—process.

I also want to thank the previous chairs of the working group. Chair Marten was the previous Chair. Last week, Nakamura was the previous Chair. Representative Hashimoto, now Senator Hashimoto, was also the previous Chair...and also, want to thank the members of the public for their continued engagement process here. So that's it. I will proceed with presentation. I'll hand it over to...

Thank you, Representative Evslin, Kila, Marten, and Poepoe. We appreciate this opportunity to provide you not only with update on what we've been doing, but in response to, you know, your appropriate scrutiny of what we've been doing with Act 279.

We have a lot to present and I think rather than going through this 44-page hard copy, which goes into detail, which we'll be giving to you if we haven't already, we'd like to highlight parts of it so that we don't use up all the time just in presenting and we would like to leave some opportunity for you to ask questions.

First, I'd like to introduce Kalani Fronda. She's heading up our development of the 28 projects that we're at. As part of the agenda, not only will he go over the use of the Act 279 monies, but also, I guess the funding that we're looking to try and address phase two of the projects relative to the 28 projects, we'd also like to get into explaining some of the innovative approaches we're using.

Then, lastly, talk about some of the legislation that would have you folks consider in assisting us in moving this program forward. So, with that, I turn it over to Fulani.

Aloha, members of the working group. I'm gonna—so, the book that you have in front of me provides a clear, organized update on how...is progressing without 279. It builds upon the original implementation plan that the Department had submitted in response to the Legislature's directive on how the 600 million would be utilized.

What you see today is an updated version reflecting the recommendations made by the Commission's Act 279 permitted interaction group and formally adopted by the Hawaiian Homes Commission in February 2024.

Importantly, the booklet includes a transparent accounting of the conferences so you can clearly see where the funds have been committed, how they support each project, and the progress being made across the implementation plan.

The intent is to offer direct data driven and on a snapshot of where funds are allocated and the measurable progress that is underway on every island. And let me just start off, before we move into the data and policy considerations, like to begin with something that grounds us in the purpose of this work.

We'll start with a short video of the...blessing. This project reflects more than construction. It demonstrates community collaboration and the movement made possible through...

Sorry...we have Representative Garcia who's...

Thank you, Chair.

Heavenly Father, we thank you for this beautiful day that we have here on the island of Maui. We thank you for all of the families that have been blessed by this great opportunity to be connected with the Aino once again.

In the past three years, we moved to four different zip codes. In two days, our new zip code, for the Lord's sake, will be forever 96793 and we feel so blessed about what's happening to us and what's going on with the Department of Hawaiian Homelands.

Hoahono carries a name that reminds us of steadfastness and perseverance. That is exactly what our homesteaders have shown—years of patience, hope, and determination. Today, that perseverance is rewarded with the keys to your new home.

The peace now that we have actually being in our home is absolutely overwhelming. And we're just so blessed. And thank you, Jesus, for this wonderful opportunity and for our new home. We're happy to be here.

...Is more than homes. It's building a community. It's building a strong community, and it's helping us go back to our roots. Mahalo for your resilience. Mahalo for your patience. But welcome home. Welcome home.

I like being home, and it's so many years since I left. At nights, I used to have memories of just coming home. And basically, I was thinking about Kahului, where I was born.

At the end of the day, it's about people. It's putting people into homes, making them a part of the community and, and making sure that this is for generations to come, right? For many of these families, they'll pass it on, and this will be the home base for many great events, many great milestones in their life.

And that's what it's all about. It's making sure that we can make that happen for many beneficiaries.

We're blessed to work with these wonderful people and they're dedicated. They want to solve the problem. They want to get Hawaiians back on their land. And when we do these projects, it doesn't just help beneficiaries, but those beneficiaries and having these houses, that opens up other housing for non-Hawaiians.

So, these projects benefit the whole community, not just the beneficiaries.

The location is perfect. It's central to everything. My son is in a great school. He just started kindergarten. He's so happy to be in his new school. So, we're very, very blessed and we're very fortunate to be here.

This blessing ceremony is not only about asking for guidance and protection over these houses, but also recognizing the kuleana that comes with homesteading. Together as a community, you will nurture this aina, uplift one another, and create a foundation for generations to come.

93 years young. She's been waiting 38 years for this opportunity. So, welcome home. Today, we have Director Kelly Watson with the keys to your...

Very happy to partake in this, you know, celebration, but also for the work wise, you know, like to you, you can see, right, Auntie Helen came home. She's 93 years old, got to move back from the continent into her new home today, and she blessed us with allowing her to be on her property today, celebrating in this momentous occasion.

I just want to tell the people, Maui, I'm so happy to be home.

So, the next several slides will provide a summary of what's included in the booklet. Rather than walking through each page, I'll highlight the areas of progress, policy considerations, and implementation milestones so the Committee has a clear understanding the work that's underway.

We have in here 3 beneficiary testimonies—3 beneficiary testimonies highlighted by Sheldian Dudewa, Tina Likeaha, and Auntie Esther. Their stories show the progress our families are experiencing today—keys being handed over, new communities forming, and long-awaited opportunities being realized. These voices remind us why Act 279 matters and who it is ultimately that we're serving.

The themes reflected in the—in this booklet—the remaining sections of the booklet outline major themes.

So, one is innovation in funding, construction methods, land exchanges, technology encumbrances, and expenditure of progress including county, federal, and LIHTC partnerships and then, new acreage acquired and the number of lots developed across each item and the three key policy considerations that may require future collaboration with this Committee.

In there, and it was in the plan that was submitted initially, was talking about homeownership versus rental activities, the level of support needed for a beneficiary, beneficiaries pursuing homeownership, and prioritization of homestead development statewide. So, these themes provide context for the decisions, timelines, and partnerships shaping implementation efforts.

You know, we really are doing things different and we've gone through kind of the tail end of how we used to do it before. Now, we're working on issuing project leases for each of the projects that working on. And what this gives us is an opportunity to work and not bypass people who can't pre-qualify.

It's being able to work with those that are in the wait list that are coming up and when they decide to say yes, we want to be a part of a project, we're issuing their project leases. This gives them a number of different things.

It gives them the opportunity to pass it on to a 25% successor or a 25% transfer. It also allows for us to work with them, go through financial assessments for those that require financial literacy and preparation, or walking with them, teaming up and partnering with service providers such as Hawaii Community Assets, LNY, and others.

Do you mind just elaborating on what a project lease is?

Sure. So, our project lease is a lease that is—it's a paper lease. So, it's not a lease that's tied to a particular lot. It's tied to a project. And what that gives us now is they have access to this project. First, they had access being a beneficiary, now they have access to a project.

And this also allows.

These are projects that are not yet underway.

It is part of the projects that we've identified in the booklet. So, you see those and there are also others that are coming up that we've had on the books for a while and we would actually want to be able to provide opportunities for those, especially as we've been seeing beneficiaries dying on the waitlist.

So, we're identifying those right now and being able to work with them. We've also directed those that we partner with to do development. So, with our developers, we're saying instead of building it and trying to figure out how we pre-qualify, build it based upon qualifying. Totally different concept.

And now, it's something that, and helping them understand that this is what you can qualify for, this is what we're going to build. So, you're going to see options that are coming up. Opportunities and options. The options that they will provide, some of them might be able to qualify for a turnkey home.

Some of them may have the financial means to be able to do owner builder. As you guys know, with construction loans, you got to come up with 20% down. Not everybody has that type of access. But in walking with our service providers, we can also find programs that provide them down payment assistance, the DPs.

Some of them might be able to qualify for self help and others because of the financial means that they're in, some of the things that they experienced during life, they may have to go with a rent with option two, purchase, where they're renting, but they're issued on project lease and so they can actually pass it on.

Very different from before, but now that you have access immediately to something that you can be able to occupy. The beauty of this is, and let me show you this real quick. So, the next policy consideration that we have is number three.

On this, what we do is not only do we look for lands that have, that are close to educational facilities, that are close to healthcare facilities but also close to existing infrastructure. So, it makes building infrastructure much more easier than trying to bring in something that's not there.

So, we're tasked with the, with the 600 mil that is given to us, we're tasked to build the infrastructure. The beauty of that is that it unlocks now about $2 billion worth for vertical development. So, the developers are bringing in that $2 billion worth of development to be able to build the houses.

So, not only are we building out the infrastructure, developing the infrastructure, we're also developing the houses so we can get our beneficiaries in too.

I have a question.

Yes.

My understanding was that the house was not part of the, the, the benefit. The house itself...suggest that the house is...

It's, it's for the land lease.

Okay. Since the house land lease, okay.

So, they pay for the—the beneficiary will pay for the house. And then the land lease is a dollar per year.

Okay. Okay.

Well, let me just add to that. It also develops on the—depends on the—approach that is being used. If you use a low-income housing tax credit with option to purchase, both infrastructure and the vertical construction is included in the cost. But as a tenant during that 15-year compliance period, technically they don't own the vertical construction.

They have option to purchase it at the end of the 1,500. That's one approach, really targeting those that are 60%...below, that would otherwise not only not be able to qualify for 10 key mortgage but more importantly, qualify for home ownership. So, this is a way where we approach and used in addressing the majority of the people on and in that approach.

In that time frame as they're renting, we have our development developers/management company that are working with them.

How do you prepare to purchase the place? And the place is that you know, when you take a look at buying a place 15 years later, it increases. Inflation happens.

For them, they're going to purchase a place based upon what they qualified for. So, it's like you qualified within this particular EMI, that's the range that you're going to have. So, we have some cases, for example in Kono, something that was awarded about five years ago, they're going to purchase it for about 350,000 at the end of 50 years.

Huge difference, huge opportunity, and they know exactly who was living there before. This next slide just shows that—how we can cover the monies. So, roughly about 511 million now went to infrastructure. About 52.8 million went towards acquisitions. Financing and beneficiary services, about 36 million, and covered, as of 1231, we have...from...

So, the idea really is for us to was really to encumber everything by the 600 mil, by December 31st. Unfortunately, we went through some budget and finance as us not being really not releasing the 11.1. But we have our contracts in place, it's ready to go. When it becomes available, we're able to encumber that right away.

What happened in last year, we had about 129 million in laps.

[Unintelligible]

So, wait, VNF is holding the last?

There's a release administrative process that they ask that we hold off of the 11.1 until March.

And that's the last one?

That's the last.

And then, if I can move forward, just for the public understanding. Chair, can you explain the difference from encumbered to...?

Okay. So, encumbering means we actually need the monies set aside for a particular project for a particular contract. So, that's what's encumbering it. We don't—and then once it's encumbered...them, that money that was allocated for that particular contract.

So, the monies, at this point, largely have been encumbered.

Yes.

However, as of December 31st, we will have 120 million.... You'll also have a breakdown based on counties on the projects, what's been—what's being encumbered for that area total, including the 600 mil, what kind of lots, the number of lots that are being developed, and what is the anticipation of construction being completed, as well as occupancy.

Thank you.

Let me just add too that you know, although the contract the funding might be encumbered, actual construction process in more 2, 3, 4 years. So, the expenditures are almost like progress—are progress made as a project moves along and is being constructed.

So, in the implementation plan that was initially provided to the working group, as well as Legislature, it totaled about 2,722. We are projecting roughly about almost seven months, 6,600, based upon what was approved by the Commission in 2024. We are going to be completing 2,472 lots that people will actually occupy.

On the far right table that you see there, it shows the lots that will be redeveloped by 20—supposed to be 2030 or 2230, sorry—is being developed. And then the waitlist—how many of the waitlist is being addressed and where. So, Hawaii, for example, Hawaii residential...380 lots will be developed.

And how many is on the waiting list? 5,991. So, that goes down. It gives you a list of each of the islands, where the projects are located, what waitlist is addressing, how many lots are going to be developed, and what weakness is addressing the very bottom. Chair, I mentioned about phase two.

So, given with the 20 lots that we have in this 600 million—20 projects, sorry—and the 600 million that's been appropriated, we still have a phase two in order for us complete all of the projects 100%. And so, as I shared with you before, it really is we need a partner.

We've been partnering with a number of different agencies, developers, et cetera. And I'll give you a quick example. One is with the County of Maui. County of Maui is doing the job affordable housing project on Lanai. As you know, Lanai doesn't have the kind of resources that all the other islands may have.

And so, we're partnering on shared infrastructure. We also have a GT...that they've put forth, that we will be able to see by 2030, roughly about 90 million.

So, we're using those types of monies to share the infrastructure, working along with the County of Maui, so we can build up the infrastructure, not only for our 75 lots that we're building in Lanai, but also for the lots that they're building for their 40 miles project.

We're also using the EP, the emergency proclamation, to directly contract the developer that's developing that because it makes sense, economies of scale, et cetera. And we're very familiar with that particular developer that won that RFP for the County of Maui because they want a contract in...that we've been working on.

Phase two, this is the lot snap we need to complete. 1684 for Hawaii residential, 1514 for Maui County, for Kauai County, 1297. Oahu, 1690. And these are the new fundings that we will need.

Now, if you take a look at, you know, one thing I had mentioned before too, that we had mentioned, was that we're actually taking yesterday's budget to do tomorrow's development. So, if we have something that's consistent each year, we can plan again accordingly.

So, for example, if we had a $25 million tranche to complete phase two, we can complete that in 20 years. However, if we have 100 million each year, we can complete all of this in 8 years. I wanted to pass this on to Chair very shortly.

And so, the very last line item that you see on the gold box at the very bottom is Oahu residential. We have 560 that we're building up there. And there's a large weakness, as you know. So, we don't have that kind of land on Oahu.

So, we got to think about density, looking at TOD, looking at opportunities where we're going up and be able to address the weakness of that. And that provides us an opportunity for us to share with you new homes and options.

Yes, I guess so. It's very obvious that with our large waiting list, over 29,000, and especially with the majority of it over 11,000 being on this island, it's only 4% of our land inventory, over 8,000 acres on this island and not all usable. It's almost mandatory for us to look at different innovative ways to provide homesteads.

So, the first that we've come up with is the Bolling Trail. It's a high rise, 23 story, it's 155 million that was put together by Sanford Carr in order to build this. We also not only were able to raise up funds, but we're also kind of getting innovative in separating the financing from the land.

And folks passed some legislation...year which allows us to separate that, whereby we can still issue a homestead lease, undivided homestead lease, for the land portion.

And then, the individual that's participating in this program can acquire or achieve home ownership by complying with 15-year requirements regarding the tax credits and various other things that if they choose, which is voluntary to participate in. So, this particular innovative approach, not only relative to the innovative financing, we were able to raise 155 million.

But what was really key about this particular financing was activity in the Legislature. Normally, developers like myself and others out in the private sector, we go into HHFT and compete for financing.

And then, when there's a QAP where you make so many points for whatever your proposal puts together, whether it's a reduction in the developer fee or the per unit cost, which is a lot more reasonable than, say, the others, as well as the fact that you have participants in the program where they typically are 60%...below.

In this particular case, the developer came to you folks, the Legislature, and you were kind enough to provide him with 80 million of the rent off, what do you call it, private activity bonds authorization.

And with that 80 million, he was able to automatically access the 4% low income housing tax credit that are set aside by the HHFTC and the feds. And so, with that, he was able to not only combine that with some money from the DERF, excuse me.

Yeah, DERF, which altogether was, excuse me, rental housing revolving from about 41.5 million, along with 4.7 million of state and federal. So, with this, not only were we able to go up and provide home ownership in an area in urban Honolulu overlooking Diamond Head, a really great location, which is, I think, very, very attractive.

But more importantly, we're able to take people off the waiting list. So, this is the first time. W anticipate doing this again. We do have several sites we're thinking of doing high rises.

And so, again, similar as an option if we are able to get you folks to support what we're doing by doing this set aside on the private activity bonds, that will facilitate not only access to other funding that we can leverage, but more importantly use our funding in a way to provide homesteads for people off our waitlist.

Another innovative, as well as a unique way, in which we provided housing as well as a different option and choice is what we did in Kaka'ako, in Kauai, the Wapoli Project involving 82 units townhouses, upgraded townhouses. It was an acquisition rather than building it from scratch.

And so, with that one, we put together the developer put together 44 in funding. And that one, they we got about 13.7 million in DERF, but we also leveraged the NAHASA funding that we were getting from the Feds. We took 25 million of that and again, submitted that along with an application.

And then, additionally, another innovative financing approach was American Savings Bank. They stepped up and provided 19.9 million in construction finance, first time ever that in this particular scenario we were able to combine the three funding sources in order to address and acquire and not only renovate but provide housing for our beneficiary.

That one was also somewhat unique in that we have a rent this option to purchase. The people that were targeting those at 30% to 120% MI. So, there's a cross section rather than the typical. And in this case, no LIHTC was used. So, again, we're looking at different innovative approaches.

But the other thing that we're also looking at is land acquisitions. So, part of the Act 279, we're acquiring lands that are in better locations, more desirable, less costly to develop. And so, with that, we've acquired lands not only in Oikai and also...and various other areas that we're looking at.

Besides the acquisition by purchase, we also have developers that are now working with us and actually donating to the Department in order to satisfy their entitlements. So, with that particular approach, not only as a Department, and more importantly, our beneficiaries become, I guess, tenants as well as homeowners in a nicely developed homesteading area that involves other than Native Hawaiians, others.

And so, there's also amenities, hospitals and other things that make that particular site very desirable. Now, I also have to acknowledge and thank you not only some of the different counties that have stepped up in order to assist us.

The City and County of Honolulu, they're looking to transfer some property in Kalaheo along with 20 million in CIP funding for infrastructure. We also have Maui County that set aside a percentage of their GET set aside, totaling about 80, 90 million by 2030.

So, it's, you know, a situation where not only do we—are starting to get partners to assist in this program—but more importantly, we're starting to chip away at that wait list. But still, even with all of that, without a doubt, we need to continue these innovative approaches.

We need to look at better ways to leverage the funding that you folks might provide us, as well as authorization on your part regarding bonding and some other source...With that, I'd like to, at this point, call Ari...

When you said...do you mean...in...?

Yes...

And so, is that moving forward? I know that you're doing assessment.

Yeah, we're still doing assessment. Still going to make sure that not only with the infrastructure costs being not prohibitive, but also, you know, I want to make sure that we build something that our beneficiaries as their homes will be safe and not subject to a lot of the problems that the surrounding homeowners are experiencing.

You know, clearly, we're not going to put any of our beneficiaries in that predicament. So, this is Ari. She has some words of wisdom for legislators and how we're going to improve the program more.

...Government Relations Program Specialist for the Department and today, we'll be going over legislative proposals that were approved by the Hawaiian Homes Commission and also support the initiatives and projects of Act 279. So, first, we have...related to housing. This proposal exempts any development, homestead lots, or housing by the Department from general excise and use taxes.

The savings resulting from the exemption from TET taxes that DGGL can potentially accrue from this exemption can be applied to the development of additional housing and associated infrastructure. Next, we have...court, relating to historic preservation reviews.

This proposal allows the Department of Hawaiian Homelands to assume review of the effect of any project for lands under our jurisdiction, except for projects affecting properties listed or nominated for inclusion in the Hawaii Register of Historic Places or the National Register of Historic Places.

The passage of this legislative proposal will allow for efficiency in process and timeline to meet expected outcomes in a timely manner through the ability to expedite the construction of proposed projects. The estimated maximum total time incurrent it takes...of DLNR to review these projects is approximately 165 days, but we recognize the pressing timeline of Act 279, as well as the urgency to serve the beneficiaries on the waiting list.

Next, we have...related to the Hawaiian Homes Commission Act. More specifically, the loan guarantee increase. This proposal increases the limit of the state's liability for monies borrowed by the Department or loans made to lessees to be guaranteed by the Department from 100 million to a greater amount.

This will help point home and lessees afford the home prices, being offered the department's turnkey offerings, and the cost for big and...home builds. So, as many of you may be aware, the Department offers direct loans for beneficiaries, and by amending Section 214 of the Hawaiian Homes Commission Act, it will allow for the Department to have a greater capacity to serve beneficiaries to loans.

Next, we have...related to the Rental Housing Revolving Fund.

This proposal permits the Rental Housing Revolving Fund to be used to provide loans or grants to buyers with incomes above 60 and at or below 140% of the median family income for the state to purchase a rental unit.

This proposal will allow DHHL beneficiaries to have access to low interest loans for projects developed with Rental Housing Revolving Fund. Last but not least, we have HB 576. So, this was actually legislation that was introduced last year by HHFDC and the Department was, of course, in support.

It relates to restrictions on the transfer of real property under Chapter 201H by...It exempts transfers of Hawaiian of the Department of Hawaiian Homelands from transfer restrictions that are pursuant to HHFDC. So, some of these transfer restrictions refer to buyback and shared appreciation of restrictions.

However, pursuant to the Hawaiian Homes Commission Act, we have separate and different provisions and this bill, which was supported by both the Department and HHFDC, will allow us to be exempt from those transfer restrictions. So, with that being said, that's most of the legislation that is supportive of Act 279, but we always remain open to ideas and initiatives from you all in support of completing all of these projects. Mahalo.

Do you have any questions? So, let's maybe start with questions just on the proposed decision while we have you here and then we can open up.

I do have a question on the first one that—or I don't know what was the first one that they passed exemption. What does that mean? Does that mean every like bit of construction material that goes into that project? What does that include?

This legislative proposal applies to all housing and homestead development by the Department. Our estimates on an annual basis for the Department in whole would be about 1.5 million per year. When we did a rough estimate for just Act 279 projects, the estimate was about 24 million.

And with that 24 million, we could provide more housing or—and/or—repair and maintenance needs for existing homesteads for their long-term use.

Okay, but how would it actually work? Like would we reimburse the Department for the...or would it be that when you go to purchase supplies, would you somehow, you know, show them that you're exempt, and you don't have to pay it at that moment or how, how would it actually work?

Yeah, normally, a GET Exemption is a form you got to submit to get approved and you identify, okay, this is a contract or subcontractor that did the work. This is a cost of the material. And then with the G, including the services, and this, with the GET, has to be weighed, it's quantified, and then, there's an approval.

So, there's a vetting as well as a review all claims for the waiver-vetted GET, and then that's approved and then it's processed. So, there's no payment of that GET or a reimbursement. There's just no payment.

So, if you go to like Hardware Hawaii or somewhere, anywhere to find your supplies, you just show them where they are...GET and you just.

Yeah, usually—it's usually between the developer or the contractor. So, yeah, they would inform the suppliers. Okay, exempt. Even on the consultant services, there's an exemption of that. So, they show their services and then normally the bottom is a GET—okay, we gotta pay that.

So, you know, asking you to pay us that, which they then use to pay for those taxes, in my view, is that why tax our beneficiaries for something that comes to the state when the state is obligated to build these facilities for them? So, that seems very unfair. It doesn't make sense.

So, that's why we're asking for a waiver of that tax charge.

Pursuant to the Governor's emergency proclamation as Kalani mentioned, we've been taking advantage of the exemptions that we've been afforded thus far, and we'd like to make this a stable form for us going forward through legislation.

Yeah, even the Governor recognizes value because on the back end, the cost of the house, if you reduce it by 4%, whatever, that's for some of our beneficiary, that is major.

Further questions on that section? On one of your recommendations, it was about the loan cap. So, right now, it's at what, 100 million?

Yes.

Okay, see, so that would change to an unspecified amount or—500 million. Okay. And on an annual basis, how much loans does the Department provide to homesteaders, and are these loans for home improvements or for stuff like that, or what are the loans primarily used for?

We, you know, it's kind of sad when you look at how many direct loans have been issued by the Department. And partly the reason for that, especially on a new project, is that in order to qualify for a direct loan from the Department, you need to be a lessee.

If you're on a waiting list, technically you're not a lessee.

So, we've changed that whereby issuing these paper leases so that now, not only do they have something in hand that they can pass on to the heir, should they die prior to the house being built, but more importantly, now, we can now access some of these direct loans that we have.

We have about 40 million in funding that we combo use it for collateral, but also, if we can use some direct loans to our beneficiary because we have assortment of different types of loans—184, 246—and you know, all kind of the house, and these is another product or loan product.

Mortgage loans or?

Mortgage loans.

Mortgage loans.

Yeah.

We previously increased them out through the Hawaiian Homes Commission Act, Section 214, from 50 million to 100 million through legislation. Now that we've been blessed with more funding to be able to serve our beneficiaries, we're hoping to increase that amount to have greater capacity to serve them.

Also, in our studies, when we increased the amount from 50 million to 100 million, our delinquency rate remained low.

Okay. Members, questions in general about the reservation?

Thanks, Ari...and Chair.

So okay, just to clarify at this point, Department, what is this, since 202, so, prior to 2022, you folks are sitting on a couple hundred unexpended project pieces, and then now we're sitting at maybe 3,000 projects issued and then in the pipeline, how much more PLs you think will be?

We will get up to about 7,000 by December 2026.

And that's identifying with Act 279 or? Okay, so, I—we're talking about the project leases and the, that approach. You folks have identified the cost for all those projects and project pieces?

Sorry, repeat that.

We've identified the cost for all the project lease projects.

You know, that, that.

Potential cost.

Yeah, we got, we got so many areas that we're looking at, so we're doing our due diligence. Even in the...you know, we don't know until we find out why, is there...solar, is there some kind of drainage system we got installed above this development?

So, the actual cost is uncertain on some of the newer projects. Some of the older projects, yeah, we're going to be very detailed. For example, in Leoli, it's costing us about 2—wait, 376,000—in infrastructure cost per lot.

That's the most expensive infrastructure cost per lot because of the blue rock and various other challenges that we're having to deal with, whereas other areas, we can get it down to maybe 150, 200,000 per lot. So, it's really—and that's just the infrastructure and you got the vertical construction which is going up unfortunately because of the cost of material, tariffs, you know, lack of sufficient labor, especially on the outer island permitting.

You know, those are areas that we're trying to address with different innovative approaches that we could get...

And if you can just clarify, I never want to assume that people watching or know, when we're saying infrastructure per lot, that's water, sewer, electricity.

If I could also add to that. And that is you had asked what about these other projects? Some other projects that are on top of the 28 projects that are identified in Act 279, you don't see the budget in the phase two because the phase two is more to complete that 279 projects.

But the other areas that we're identifying, such as Hana, we've identified how many lots of you can actually show up. There's still a process that we ought to go through. We're doing some of the due diligence, but we have an estimated budget on what it could come out for infrastructure.

Okay. When we are looking at all the DHHL projects, so Act 14, right, there's some...you folks identified in here, is that a partnership with folks at DLNR who could potentially?

No. There's no partnership with DLNR. We're trying to get more land from them. That's the only. I don't know if you'd call it a partnership. I take that back. Under Act 14, we're short about 552 acres. We've identified parcels.

We're working with the DLNR, not only under Act 14, which is over 20 years old, that's 16,580 acres that have been transferred to the Department to make it. So, we're at the tail end. Hopefully before the end of the year we'll finish that. Most of the parcels have come from DLNR.

But this, this time around, we're looking at DOA, HHFTC, ACDA, as well as DLNR. So, we hope to finish that off prior to the end of the year. I must say that DLNR has been very, very responsive and helpful in trying to address that.

And I think...I know, right, that DLNR has amazing land that could be farmed for our beneficiaries to issue pastoral and hemlock awards. Right? So, what we're doing to make the trust full, are some of those agencies, could that also be DOE? Could that be, UH? Are they considered in that same scope of land to justify?

We've had some preliminary discussions before. You know, like in...there's some great lands right adjacent to our kind of healing project that the UH West Hawaii has identified for rentals. I'd rather see, rather than rentals, homesteaders right adjacent where we have four different homestead communities.

So, as well as a TOD station, there's a couple parcels there we're going to go up, as well as mixed use. So, there's a variety and going to be a significant number of homesteaders there. And so, part of it is, you know, we want to expand and use lands that are adjoining.

Like I said, we have over 11,000 on our wait list and to be quite frank, Kapolei seems to be the best area right now, most viable for us.

So, so question about the project leases. So, for example, the project in Waili'ili, the...when the residents move in, they're renters. Is this project doing their rent with option to purchase as well or it's just straight up rent?

Yeah, this one, you know, one of the challenges when you do a conversion is that the lenders, in this case our biggest—wouldn't call it an obstacle, it's more educational process—is with HUD because they're providing a loan that needs to, when you look at it, it has to be paid off or whatever or moving, continuing on, similar to the legislation we're doing with the HHFD, see Rental Housing Revolving Fund, rather than having the homesteader go out and get a new loan, we just continued that on.

But in the HUD situation in the Mo'Ilili, it's a little different because it also has tax credits involved, as well as bonds. So, now, it's a little bit more challenging and the project will be done in about a year.

So, we're in the process of discussing with the, not only the LIHTC funder, but also the HUD, to make sure that they're okay, which I think they should be, because really, what we're talking about is a homestead lease that we hope to issue up front rather than having them comply with 15 years.

And if they don't make it to the 15 years, they lose everything. So, that's why we did the separation of the land and issuing the homestead for the land versus a vertical construction which is financed in a different way.

That we got to, we still got in—our homesteaders still have to comply with those requirements under that funding and financing approach. But if—with—the okay of the lenders and the financiers that we show homestead lease for the land portion undivided, we should be good. And more importantly, we'll give our beneficiaries something that they have, rather than just a grantor.

When you pass away, you got nothing to pass on to your kids.

So, so the residents moving in, will they be removed from the wait list?

Well, we hope to and that's why we're making the changes. Right now, we're in discussions. We hope to complete the discussions, get an agreement, within six months.

Because I, I guess the, the common public concern that I get from emails and phone calls and stuff is that in the rental projects, we're building rentals, but they won't be removed from the wait list until they purchase the rental at the end of 15 years.

So, are we using funds from, from the, the, the law to build rentals which will not remove people from the waitlist?

Yeah. And again, last year, you guys passed a law that allowed us to separate the land vertical construction to allow us to issue overseas for the land portion. We did that specifically to address the problem you're talking about where you're a renter, you gotta wait 15 years before the conversion.

Like our whole Lima Lima Project, which we did the conversion, but those guys were at risk and fortunately, nobody passed away from the 72 involved in that. But you know, when you dealing with the majority of our beneficiaries or elderly, you gotta kind of look out for the worst and trying to adjust the problem up front.

So, the idea on that one is to issue a home slate list at the beginning of the 15-year period. And that's what we intend to do.

I don't anticipate a problem in that, you know, when you—and both are tied together. Just like our...there's a, there's a rental contract, a purchase agreement, there's also a deal with the developer regarding the transition from, in that case, a 10-year buyback transition period, actually 11-year.

But you know, in that one, again, it's a matter of getting them a lease up front. Sure.

But once they, they receive the taken off that project lease, they're off the wait list?

Okay, so, so we have a project in... We're going through the process now because of the new law and putting together drafting of those leases, so those renters will get a project lease or homestead lease for the area that they're living in.

And so, that way, if anything happens to them, they can actually pass it on to a successor that's 25%.

Quick follow up for that. So, how does that work for a LIHTC project?

The LIHTC project?

Yeah, but so, you can have a 15-year rent-to-own on a LIHTC?

Well, it's not a rental, it's a rent with option to purchase. And they still got to comply with the 15-year period, but they get a lease for the land portion up front

And then after 15 years, they'll—they don't.

Convert it. There's a collapse.

We're doing a CPR with a separation of the vertical from the land and at the end of the period, that CPR collapses into one and then they also identify the lot and there's an attachment to the lease, homestead lease, that now, at that end of the 15 year period, identifies a specific house or, in this case like Waipuli, the particular unit.

So, because typically what we see with LIHTC projects is the 60-year affordability period, rental affordability, and then conversion after 60 years. So, is that with?

That's replaced with the homestead lease. 99 was another option for another 100 years.

I know. I—so I'm just wondering with LIHTC, so you're, so there's no issues, 15-year conversion essentially holding LIHTC projects and they're.

We've got it.

Are they getting locked in based on their AMI in the beginning of 15-Year period? And then, if the beneficiary passes away, what you're saying within that 15 year period, their...

Substantive issue.

There's also a qualification process. The ER needs to be—needs to qualify.

Before the.

Within the AMI rent?

Right.

And under 60% AMI?

Whatever they are qualified for, based upon that data.

And depending on the project, Waipulu one, it goes up to 120% AMI.

But not—but so, for LIHTC projects specifically?

Then even the Haza goes up to 80% AMI.

So, we got a variety, and you know, like obviously we have a variety of people on our waitlist, so we try to address all the different people on the waitlist based on their income. That's why—that's the nice thing about the project leases is that we issue them out before we even do an assessment of the recipients.

Just based on the waitlist, just based on they want this particular project after we finish issuing out all the project leases, then we do an assessment of all the awardees. Okay, what's your income? Is it just you or is there four kids or whatever?

Then we try to target and we require the developer to take that into account when they do their capital stack, as well as how they lay out where they the different types of participants and categories are involved, because you have the LIHTC group and that is kind of a specific number of lots.

Like, for example, the Kapolei project, Kaukahai, you know, we have about 700 awardees and we've given out turnkey types approach in the first phase. In the second phase, we require the developer and we've done the project lease awards. Now, we're working with Helen Wai and her group to do an assessment of all the different recipients, the remaining ones.

And then they use that, the developer uses that info to figure out, well, you know, I got 200 people of 60% AMI and less. So, they need to then go in with an application, assuming they're going to have to LIHTC by February of next year. So, there's certain things that need to be done.

So that's why Gentry, who's a developer is working with MDI, who's familiar with LIHTC. So, that combo, as well as the requirement we're imposing on the developers, these 200, the only way they're going to get home ownership is you do a LIHTC and that's what they do.

And the Bolo Drome project, is that 100% LIHTC?

No, that's 4%, what, is a combo. The Bolo Drome is a little bit of a different animal in tha, you know, it's more than the 60% in AMI. You go up to higher than that.

So, some of them on the transition at the end of the 15 year period may need to just get straight up, or they all got to get loans. But we're not limited to 60% anymore.

And I guess what I'm going to get with that—so, if you have...to a beneficiary, the beneficiary qualified under 60% AMI for one of the LIHTC units in the Bolo Drome project and they pass away, but the heir makes more than 60% and doesn't qualify for a LIHTC unit, is there the possibility of them, instead of not having any unit available for that area, they could get one of the other non-LIHTC units in that project?

Well, if they're overqualified, you know, we're looking at trying to compensate the heir in some way regarding possibly giving them a different unit or a different place in the homestead projects. We—all these different projects we have, we take a look at that.

But there's also, you know, you can work with those individual, you know, in order to qualify them.

And then, from an online tech branch with the officer purchase projects, so that purchase price is locked in from day one of the...

Well, it's, it's, I wouldn't say locked in. It's—there's a range because it depends on the interest on the debt. It may go up or down. So, the net debt that's left, you know, maybe more or less.

So, you adjust your sales price to the remaining debt along with the outstanding taxes, along with the conveyance fees and then that—you do the calculation, come up with the purchase price.

Are those all based on income also or is it just the LIHTC payments that you're basically?

Well, the income would go more to the debt and their ability to qualify for a takeout role. That's more, you know, the nice thing about these types of projects, the units are made available to people in different AMIs. So, it's not all one.

So, the lower income, the 30%, you know, they get units that the rent is significantly lower than somebody that's 120% AMI. So, their 30% guys are more comfortable—not only comfortable but are able to pay the rent because the rents are based on HUD guidelines that are I guess laid out and issued every year.

And so, there's an adjustment. Go up and go down but it's reflective of the economy at that time. Now, let me also say that for those, other than 80% Nahasa participants, if that individual should increase his income, it does not disqualify them from staying in the unit.

The qualification is the initial assessment, then they get in the unit. So, if you should do better, get a better job and all that, there's no disqualification.

And then, one more question on those lines. So, for, say...project, which is not a...project, those units would be the equivalent of a project lease also?

Yeah, it's a project lease but now it is a little different because you have all these common areas because it's townhouses. So, the, the homestead lease is not just under the unit, all common areas also. So, they're going to lease, homestead lease that area also.

And they're all...so every person moving into one of those units.... And then, sorry—and then if they opt not to purchase at the end of that 15-year period, will go back on the waitlist?

Well, that one isn't a 15 year, it's 11—11 year. At the end of the 10 year rental, they have a year to do the conversion, and you know, get their finance and all that in place so that there's a smooth transition to the home ownership and they have a loan in place.

And if they determine their family situation changes or situation changes and they want, you know, say we have a home somewhere and they opt then not to purchase and go back on a waitlist versus someone else.

You know, that would be very unlikely because of the, I guess equity, as well as the value that they would be giving and have to give up to do what you're saying, that I'd say would be foolish.

So, we would probably talk them out about giving it up and then they could maybe convey it to another family member or something like that. But we work with them, but we definitely don't want them to lose all that equity. Huge amount of equity.

So, on the projects like this, my understanding is that Kapolei, you had planned something with town homes and the beneficiaries rejected it wanting single family homes. Did I mis-remember that?

Well, we did a survey back in 2020 that kind of laid out what would you like. And clearly, the majority wanted the single family residential. Now, I think that.

So sorry, just as a follow up to that then, what has the response been with projects like the Bolo Drome? Have there been a lot of beneficiaries very interested in that or are they saying...?

You know, we haven't done the marketing yet. We'll probably start about six months. But I also want to, when we market it, hopefully by that time, we'll be able to say, you know, there's also this pathway to home ownership too that you'd be participating in.

And just being a renter. We don't want to be giving these beautiful condos to individuals that are just rental, when they pass away and have nothing to pass on to their family. So, the idea is all 278 units will be able to be passed on to their beneficiary. So, we're working on that.

Representative Marten, we had a...is an area where it is common houses. And so, we have multifamily. So, we did have conversations with those that attended and many of them, because of their age, is looking forward to a property like that.

And so, you have over half of the beneficiaries are actually kupuna each and so some of them, you know, they want to pass it on, their single-family home to a granddaughter. Some of them that want to live in it, they appreciate places like this.

Let me also say that in making these project...we've been very, very respectful, responsive, as well as work with the people coming off the wait list that, you know, in a lot of instances, especially if they're elderly, they may have already a house. So, you want to give it to the kid.

It might be just 25%. So, we might have a simultaneously award and transfer. They can give it to the 25%.

I have a question on the Kaupea Project in Kapolei. So, 60 homes are being planned to build there. On the infrastructure, I guess expense, do you folks still intend to build a stoplight on Kapolei Parkway adjacent to that Kaupea Project?

Because what I heard from HHFTC is that DHHL was planning to put in that stoplight with the construction of the 60 homes.

I would have to—we would have to get back to you.

Okay.

Okay.

I would say we want to put a stop light there.

Yeah. Because I mean either a stoplight or a crosswalk there. There used to be a crosswalk. It was removed during the resurfacing of Kapoli Parkway. But they said no stop, no, no crosswalk because you, you folks plan to build the stoplight there.

So, let me just.

Okay, thank you.

Wait, on that question, is it the department's responsibility or is that DTS's responsibility? Is parkway DOT or DTS?

It's—we pay for that. Yeah, unfortunately.

So, there are off-site development requirements that we have been tasked to do. And some of—sometimes it is a stoplight.

However, we do turn over eventually once we complete that off site development—turn over the management with an agreement to DTS. They manage it thereafter, on the new demands.

Thank you, Chair. Okay, if you folks can clarify this one for me because I, I often feel like as we've talked about Act 279, one of the larger misconceptions is that DHHL is exempt from all of these things, which may or may not be true. But DHHL, as we issue all of these projects, are still subject to—correct me, right, prevailing wage, same laws.

We use the same kind of workforce. We're not spreading the workforce. Like I think there's like this perception that we're going to bring in like these workers to help lower the cost of them. All of our projects, right, for the Department, we use state reports.

Yes.

In the same way...?

We've signed the state assignment agreement.

Prevailing wage agreements? Okay. Because I think as we've like discussed a lot of these things, like I know the public has found frustration with the cost. But I think for me, and I think many others, is I think when we look at the frustration, it's rooted in time.

Right? Because $650 million, two decades ago, you probably could have extended the waitlist, but that's not the hand we were dealt. Right? So, this is where we're at today. Could you folks clarify for us, when you're looking at all the holdups that you folks are experiencing, is that internally a holdup or would you say the holdup happens with our county workers?

Well, the permitting has been a challenge.

And that is at what level? Internally or?

Well, we're starting to work with the different, at the county level, farming, planning, and permitting. So, we've had discussions, we're looking at ways to expedite, trying to do templates, pre-approved, different housing models so that developers use that and expedite the process.

We're also looking at doing some of the permanent in-house. We did that on our transitional homeless shelter in Kalailoa, where we're doing a 20-unit shelter conversion for people on our wait list. So, now we did our own permits as well as issued a certificate of documents.

So, that's something I prefer not to because I like to have the inspectors that are more familiar with ordinances and requirements to actually do that. But we also in house are bringing on or brought on somebody that can also do that for us. So, yeah, the delays, I wouldn't say—it's humble.

I'm not going to say the Department is, you know, really cranking it out and doing everything right. We do need more staff. That's, that's obvious. As we study these different projects, the reality is it's a collective process. You cannot just do it independently. Whether it's actual construction—we've got to rely on developers.

There's approvals of some of the infrastructure, the water, water supply, sewer system. That doesn't happen overnight. There's also limitations in some of the utilities and we are working with the counties in some stuff including the border water supply here. So, it's, it's very challenging.

Because I think for one, like I worked and reviewed projects with the full place, I think the larger thing is that I know we want to create the partnerships with the county, but I think at the state level, we've identified at times the county has been the barrier to fulfilling the mandate. Not just at DHHL and agencies like DHFDC.

So, at what point do we want to be good neighbors, but at the point of fulfilling the mandate, use the hammer that has been afforded to the Department in some cases. Right? Because I think this concept that you folks aren't building things to permit or to code is not fair nor true.

No, that's kind of a last resort. But we, for the smaller projects, we are doing that way because homeless...trying to deal with the homeless, we need to crank it up. I wouldn't say that, maybe historically, that's been a real problem.

But I think we're developing good working relationships with the different counties and so, I look forward to that, working combined with infrastructure, like...mentioned, the Lanai project, that's a county project that has been issued and developer has been chosen. So, we're working with the developer to combined it to 75 units.

We're going to do in addition to what the county is doing and that also has been in part financed by part of the GET revenues that were set aside by the Maui County. So, you know, it's a great, and I look forward to working with the county.

Okay. On that discussion of the counties, are there any other counties that have explored that partnership of deeding? So, are the county...right now that you see on Oahu County to do something similar?

On Kauai, we actually, you know the Waipoli Project was—originally, a county had the option to purchase and three of the mayors went through and been able to put the financing together. We were able to do it. So, we closed on that $45 million project just recently. So, now, it is moving forward.

But the county and the mayor in that instance was very supportive. They couldn't do it so they stepped on the side and did us.

So, at Hawaii Count, there's a revolving fund that they have. We've been in discussion with them on how do we address it going towards the beneficiaries for down payment assistance, for renovation of houses, etc., working along with our partners to be able to provide that administration of that.

We've also talked with a number of different counties on land exchanges that make sense for both of us. Some of them in a case might make sense for them to do a regional park. For us, it makes sense for us to utilize an area that's, that's more efficient and more suitable for us to do homestead housing.

So, it's those kind of discussions that we've been having that's been very beneficial for the Department.

And then for—I, I was wondering, have the tariffs instituted affected any of the projects that you folks are going on?

I would, I would think so.

But just, we can't quantify it yet? Okay. And then on that, what you folks just mentioned with, as we were talking about the different counties, are—so, when LUC does regional plans or even approves how much acreage or units in one area, if the Department was to go into a project and handle the entitlement for a parcel, are you folks still technically subject to the LUC requirement? You folks are exempt?

So, an entitlement for a parcel that caps a project at, say, 500, if the Department went in there, took the entitlement and built houses, your allocation would—wouldn't affect the LUC?

Well—ignore it. Representative Kila. No, there's obviously some kind of logic to the 500, so we would take that into consideration. We try to be good neighbors, so to speak. And just like Kalaheo, you know, we could have put a high rise over there, but obviously we're not.

Even Hawaii Kai, we could, you know, build another high rise, but we put in townhouses, as well as single residential units of a comparable sub park house size, as a neighbor. And so, our approach has been to be good neighbors to fit into the community.

It's almost like an infill project versus something that would stand out and create a lot of objections and possible litigation. You know, that's one thing that me, as a developer, the worst thing you can get is litigation.

So, we try to do everything right, but at the same time, we're not flaunting and we do it in a way that fits into the community.

Because I think on largely to your point, Chair, and I think Rep. would—I mean, I'm sure Rep. Garcia appreciates one day having the largest homestead community. But when we look at it—what?

Seven years away.

Oh, I was like seven years ago. I think right to say that we have that for now until complex fully built out.

But I want, and I think our beneficiaries deserve, like access to places in downtown Honolulu, beautiful parks within Kailua, and if that is partnering the future projects that exist in these areas to find a way, if those entitlements can be satisfied with the Department, I would fully support us moving that way forward, so every community can acknowledge, not just homesteaders.

In Waianae, Nanapuri, Kapolei, we put them everywhere.

That's not planned.

Every—nice area.

And a good example is in...Kauai. The prices that are found on agricultural land—quick question—have you guys utilized DIRF for infrastructure and not...?

For the Waipoli Project, we're using DIRF in order to finance primarily the construction. In that case, it was more construction rather than acquisition or infrastructure. And that one is a renovation project, but it's not for infrastructure or for improving the vertical construction.

I was surprised, I guess expected, but surprised to see that construction costs have doubled since 2019, as you guys put in your template here. And as you know, you mentioned if you had it dedicated funding source, I think Kalani said $100 million per year, that you could, you know, award all the project pieces within the years.

You know, if you folks had a dedicated funding source, would that enable you to utilize work DIRF on a large scale for infrastructure, essentially locking those costs early on with the interest rate and pay that would...?

Well, DIRF is, you know, it's—typically, historically, they're not large loans, usually about 10 million. So, it's not a real major source of infrastructure funding. So, looking at maybe some bond sales to get into the infrastructure financing, I think that one is 502, 513, that they use at the University.

Looking at using that, looking at working with... They have a funding source. They want to partner with us on some stuff. So, I'm saying, well, use your bond authorization. So, we're trying to get them to use their bonds.

We have about 80 million in bonds that we're looking to recycle and use it on some of these...project for phase two. So, there's a variety of approaches. Granted, we like the lump sums you guys give us, but the reality is, especially this year, we need to get a little bit more creative.

And does all of that rely on a dedicated funding service?

Dedicated funding service?

If you guys had, you know, if you guys are floating...or can you use your annual—if you had a dedicated funding source.

That will help. That will help. Definitely. We can leverage that and borrow a lot more money, make the lenders, bond issuers look at that.

You feel comfortable in not only grading you in AA or whatever, as well as recycling. We're also looking at some of the existing bonds out there with whether it's a county or HHFTC to recycle those. But that's all in the timing of the use of those funds. So, we're looking at some of our phase twos.

Maybe we can time it where they can use the recycled bonds.

Any other questions? ...Question was is this our last...and I think these promptly, right, we have a report which we're going to do before the start of this session and then, a final report before the start of the 2027 session.

So, we might do maybe one final one next summer depending on the things change on your folks front before these allocations are going, but tentatively, this might be our last...

We're available anytime. Look forward to working with you.

[Unintelligible]

Yes. I just want to thank Chair Evslin and the work of the Committee to see this through. We were elected post who said amen the year after it was allocated and put forth, and I am fully aware of the challenges that the Department faces.

But I think I would—all of us in this room—could agree there is no greater mandate...which has made the Department of Hawaiian Homelands. And you folks are subject to the hand of what is known as the Legislature.

And as I said prior, I wish that this money came 20 years sooner because the cost then would have been much lower. We could have addressed so many things but that's not the reality we live in now, so as we head into the session and what, what is to come, I would like to say I can tell you that—I speak for myself.

I'm sure they would agree that every member on this Committee wants to see the path forward to achieve something for the Department, not as a handout, but as a right and entitlement.

Because I say it now and I'll say it always, when we always are beneficiaries, we call somebody. When you take a native Hawaiian off the list and you put them into a home, that is keeping our workforce here. That is addressing the cost of living and that is keeping...Hawaii...

But without our native Hawaiian community and Hawaii, there is no way. So, when we look at all these creative tools in our toolbox of addressing how we keep folks here, it's in our toolbox now. That is, until Congress or someone else says otherwise.

We have a legal way to—I don't want to say discriminate housing, but to house a preference group and what is often times the ones that hurt the most is native Hawaiians, so...I don't envy the role you're in.

I know there's not a waiting list for the position as the Chairman of the Commission, but I'm happy to be in this time today serving in this body with these folks and your folks' leadership and I, I just want to thank you folks for the time.

Appreciate it.

Thank you. Thank you for being here and and for keeping us posted and updated.

I think going through this next session, I'm sure the discussion will come up again about more funding perhaps, but I think just keeping us updated on the specific $600 million and how they're being used I think will go a long way here in the building as far as keeping our colleagues aware of all the expenses. Thank you.

Yeah, I just want to echo my colleagues sentiment here, just my appreciation to you folks, for your hard work here. You have a huge task in front of you, and I appreciate the work that you have done to spend on $600 million.

What I think is, you know, mostly wise waves and you know, it becomes just more and more clear with every act...we've had is the need for lots more funding for...folks to complete and you know, seeing your 6,300 project leases forward in 2024.

And we need to see that through to ensure that those project uses. You know...the way that we can do that is with, you know, hopefully dedicated funding source going forward. We can figure out a way to do that and also, create a financing method...figuring out.

So, I appreciate all the work that you did on that front. And as Rep. Kila said, we talked a lot about trying to ensure that when we are building housing in Hawaii that this is going to residents of Hawaii and we are really constitutionally limited in ways to do that.

But you guys can do it obviously better than anybody. Cannot address things at Hawaii... The longest term intergenerational residents that we have in...so, I think...is clear that we always ensure that you guys are...l Looking forward to continued collaboration and generating our report from the house for...

Okay, thank you. Thank you very much. Appreciate your time.

Thank you. Seeing no further business, this hearing is adjourned.