Senate Standing Committee on Education

Good afternoon, folks. And we are a little delayed. We apologize, for the three committee hearings on, the hearing notice on Tuesday, March 24, the committees on transportation, energy and intergovernmental affairs, the Committee on Energy, and it's at the 3PM agenda. However, it's 3:21. We will also want to remind those that we'll be testifying that we will allow one minute for this particular session, and that decision making will follow on this one agenda item.

So, with that said, HB 2,033, house draft two relating to transportation. And it's a long, long part one. I will just summarize in saying that this is an omnibus bill with the many, many parts on it. And some of, most of you are here that know and understand what's on it. It also requires sellers and the licensed dealers to ensure that the motor vehicle is equipped with the front number plate mounting bracket and device.

It also talks about the number plates on vehicles. It also on part two, part three talks about the speed enforcement system, systems program. And it's parts four that allows the counties for the license plate and part five, it falls upon cameras. Okay. Let's proceed with testifiers before us as well.

Okay. Transportation, DOT.

Aloha, Chairs, Vice Chairs, Members of the committees, MPDOT. We stand on our very successful needs strong support.

Thank you. Okay. Thank you so much. Attorney General. Good afternoon.

Good afternoon. Vice Chairs and Members of the committee.

Deputy Attorney General, Martie Lau here. Our department has submitted written testimony providing comments on this bill. Our testimony includes attachment one, which sets forth our suggested replacement wording for parts four and five of the bill. Part four of the bill addresses an automatic license plate recognition system, and part five of the bill addresses the school bus infraction detection system.

We understand that both of these proposed systems contemplate using technology devices similar to what is currently used under chapter two ninety one j, which addresses photo red light imaging detectors and two ninety one l, which regards which

which is which addresses automated speed enforcement systems. Such that certain provisions from those chapters could support proper implementation and enforcement of these new systems. Chapter one suggested replacement for these new systems with the additional provisions to support their implementation and enforcement. I'm available for questions. Thank you for the opportunity to testify.

And let me say that attorney General's office, thank you so much for helping us to review this, this bill. And you know, it's sort of, as we look into it, you know, there are some flaws in certain areas, the penalties, there was none, and I really appreciate the help and, that we do have a proposed SD one, But I must commend you folks for helping us with this measure. Okay. Thank you so much. Okay.

DOJ, Department of Education, Keith Hayashi.

Aloha Chairs, Vice Chairs, Keith Hayashi Dio, testifying on behalf of the Department of Education.

Okay. Thank you. Judiciary Michelle Acosta on Zoom.

Good afternoon Chairs, Vice Chairs, Members of the committee Michelle Costa here on behalf of the judiciary. We stand on our written testimony with comments, and and I'll be available for questions. Thank you.

Okay. Thank you very much. And on Zoom, we do have, Nikos Leverenz. Aloha.

Aloha, Chairs, Vice Chair, Members. Nikos Leverenz testifying in my own capacity. I'm offering comments on this bill. I know that the train has already left the station. And I'm just, very concerned that the that about the proposed statutory language in part four.

Statutory language must be more exacting so that those in the executive branch and its contractors have clear parameters that reflect our state's abiding commitment to individual liberties against government overreach. ALPR data has already been used by law enforcement on the continent to exact punishment on those from vulnerable populations, including women seeking needed reproductive health care services and those who are migrants. In contrast to the broadly permissive approach taken in this bill, the Washington legislature recently sent SB 6,002, the driver privacy act to governor Ferguson's desk.

The bill provides express specific restrictions on the use of data and where such data may not be collected. The bill also restricts the ability of vendors to skirt public oversight and accountability by mandating that they provide government with technical controls and expressly preventing the selling, leasing, or renting of data or allowing access to non authorized agencies.

You know half a century ago Hawaii was at the forefront of protecting the privacy interests of individuals against state intrusion, including a provision in our constitution expressly acknowledging a right to privacy. So I'm very hopeful that policy makers will consider putting in some parameters and some guardrails to preserve our larger privacy interests. Mahalo for the opportunity to provide testimony.

Nikos, did you have a chance to look at the SD one as proposed by the attorney general?

Not yet, ma'am.

Okay. I think

I can provide feedback on that, but yeah. I'm hopeful.

If you can go online, you'll find it as well, but I think it has been pretty much covered and the concerns that you raised as well. Mahalo. Okay. And look at it. Alright. Department of customer services, City and County of Honolulu.

Hi. Good afternoon, Chairs, Vice Chairs, committee Members. Megan Johnson on behalf of Armando customer services, City and County of Honolulu. We stand on our retained testimony in support of this discussion. Thank you.

Thank you. Advocates for highway and safe Oahu, auto safety. Okay.

SANS communication in support. Ampo, in support as well. Kristen Ito in support, Nicholas Wong, Rex Katahara and Kenneth Hsu, all in support. Is there anyone else wishing to speak on HB 2033? Okay.

Hearing none, members, we have, communicated with the chairs as well with report, with, an amendment to the measure and we, IT, we will not go into recess. The chairs, have confirmed that we will be making decisions on this measure. So the chair's recommendation, on this, HB 2,033, relating to transportation. The chair's recommendation is to go with the attorney General's, SD one as, as proposed. And also we'd like to add that with regards to the mobile safe vehicle safety inspection.

We would like to add the language requiring that DOT must adopt rules, allowing for motor vehicle safety inspection for passenger cars, and also with technical and non substantive amendments. Any discussions? Yeah. Yes. Yes.

Senator can we.

Okay. Another day. We've dealt with this. Yes. Yes.

We we've dealt this with before, but I'm sure we'll do something next year. Thank you, Chair. Okay. For the committee I'm trying. Okay.

I know, I know. And we also added at one time. Let's go two years. Okay. So the Chair's recommendation is to pass the measure, with amendments for the Committee on Transportation, and HB 2033 house draft two is to pass with amendments.

Any discussions? Hearing none, Vice Chair for the vote, Chair goes Aye.

Chair's recommendation is to pass HB 2033 House Draft 2 with amendments, Chair and Vice Chair vote Aye. [Roll Call] Madam Chair recommendations adopted.

For Members of EIG, same recommendation. Any discussion? If not, Senator Chang, I vote yes.

Thank you.

Chair's recommendation for House Bill 2033 is to pass with amendments. Chair and Vice Chair vote Aye. [Roll Call] Recommendation is adopted.

Okay. And for the Chair Committee on Education, same recommendation to amend HB 2033, House Draft 2, to a, amendments as stated by the, Transportation Chair. Any discussion members? Hearing none, Chair votes Aye.

[Roll Call] Excused. Measure is adopted.

Thank you.

Thank you. That concludes then this trip, the three committees. Committee on transportation, energy and inter governmental affairs, and the committee on education.

Thank you for your patience. We're convening our joint committee with the Committee on Energy and Economic Energy and Intergovernmental Affairs and our friends in the Committee on Transportation on this March 24. We're on the 301 agenda in Room 229. We have one measure on this agenda. That is House Bill 2022 HD 1 relating to motor vehicle registration.

On our testifiers list, we have the Tax Foundation of Hawaii.

Good afternoon, Chairs, Vice Chairs, Members of the committee. Tom Yamachika from Tax Foundation. We'll stand on our written comments and be available for questions.

Thank you, Tom. Tina Yamaki from the Hawaii Transportation Association. Members has submitted testimony in opposition. Is there anyone else wishing to testify on House Bill 2,022? Oh, no.

Sorry, Chair. We have Tina Yamaki on Zoom.

Okay. Thank you. Welcome, Tina.

I apologize for not being there in person, but I am on Zoom. I'm Tina Yamaki with the Hawaii Transportation Association, and we stand on a written testimony. We do wanna point out that this is gonna be a substantial increase, in operations for a lot of our mom and pop businesses and all businesses in general. And what's gonna happen is they're gonna pass that on to their customers, which is the retailers, and the retailers will pass that on to, the consumers.

So prices will go up possibly because of this. Mahalo.

Thank you, Tina. Is there anyone else wishing to testify in House Bill 2022. Please step forward.

Good afternoon, Chairs, Vice Chairs, committee Members, and Customer services, City and County of Honolulu. We stand on our written testimony respectfully opposing this measure.

Thank you, Megan. Is there anyone else wishing to testify on this measure? If not, members, any questions?

You mentioned the Hawaii County Center. Communication. Mayor Kimo Alameda.

Yeah. The Members have the testifier's testimony. The county of the Big Island County has submitted testimony for opposition as well as Johnny May Perry has submitted commentary. Is there anyone else wishing to testify in this measure? If not, Members, any questions?

Megan?

Thank you, So just what this building is saying. So each island have a different pay rate. So, anyway, reason why I know that, I was so fortunate that my car registered in Hilo, and it was almost 50% or more less. And then we still yet to this day. Maybe you have the it could be clarified clear clear to us.

We paid this weight tax and this road tax to fix our roads. How much money is spent every year on fixing these roads? Because it doesn't seem to get I mean, not knocking you, but we're just saying not seem to be getting anything done. And the neighbor islands seem to get a logistics on the roads in repairs and especially, like, in with Hilo. We get a lot of rain, but it doesn't seem to have as much potholes in the county as much we have in Honolulu.

So, again, I just it doesn't match up for me that we're paying so high, almost double in weight tax on Oahu, and then the neighbor islands is not as much. But they get the same job done on a larger scale because Hilo, if you know the roads, is long. And we don't have as much potholes in Hilo as we have in Oahu on a shorter distance of road.

So can you give it like, maybe I don't know if you have the numbers, but can you tell us how is that money being spent, and why is Oahu so much higher than the neighbor islands?

Thank you, Senator Fevella, for the question. I actually have with me our division of motor vehicle program administrator. Okay. And I think that he would be able to provide more information.

Thank you very much. Appreciate it.

Yep.

Thank you.

Good afternoon. Good afternoon, committee Members. William Trujillo, the division of motor vehicles program administrator for the City and County of Honolulu. Senator, thank you for your question and I 100% agree. I recently moved from Kauai and so I understand the price differences between neighbor islands and Oahu and how it how it plays out and how it affects everybody.

In terms of the how much is spent on roads and what is done, we don't have that with us right now. We can definitely, respond to that and and provide better information about where the funds go to. For the counties, we can say that the funds, are put into general funds for sure. And how the each administration and county spends those funds is, as you know, under under their purview.

But, yes, I agree that each each county has their own funding and has their own way of administering.

So the vehicle tax that they collect for the county goes into a general fund?

For the city, County Of Honolulu for sure. And I can triple check with the other counties, but I believe it's the same.

Okay. So does I mean, I don't know. It's the first time I'm hearing this, so forgive me for my ignorance, but I always thought it was mainly for specified road repairs and road conditions and roads. So so we now we put this in general fund. That means if I take majority of the funds, it'll put dollar in the road and a $100 someplace else.

There's nothing we can do.

I can't speak to that, but Okay.

No. The reason why I'm asking this is because, again, in Honolulu The last five years, our weight tax increase tripled more than any other neighbor island in the last five years. And I can go forward and on. I got rid of a vehicle because it's gonna cost me almost a thousand dollars to register them in the Wahoo. Same vehicle that I bought, of course, the vehicle is twenty years old.

Same vehicle about twenty years ago went up three times the price so that I couldn't afford it, and I I just got rid of the car.

But, again, how we I just wanna know how the community out there, people like me, don't know how is it justified that we can continue to hike up a registration on Oahu to justify our roads, but then we don't see the condition as we see on the maintenance that we have on the neighbor islands and how well repaired some of the maybe not all or the ones I drove on was well repaired.

So I just wanna know how we can figure this out so the community can know where is this I mean, you said the funds going, but the statistics why why is it the increase constantly going up and up? You do it. The city has a special fund that they want us to raise so they can go in general fund and continue to rake it.

I don't know. You don't need to answer that. But can you just at least find out why that it it is so lopsided?

No. In terms of the between the counties?

Yeah. Yes. I Appreciate

it. Yes. For sure.

K. Thanks for being here as well for the city and county. So with that said, is there any ordinances that was created by the county here to create a special fund or fund for road fixing?

Thank you very much.

I'm not aware of anything that flags or earmarks funds for for roads.

Okay. Okay. Then, Senator, Fevella, just to add this, why the mayor of the county of Hawaii has sent testimony against this measure is because in the nineteen eighties, I was on the county council at that time, we created an ordinance, that part of the gas tax goes into a special fund to, for road fixing.

And so it has been ongoing, and, so, so for each council district, there's a plan of how much of that fund goes to the different districts so that the council chair the council member then can decide to to speak with the administration what rules that they would want to fix immediately in their districts. So we do have a process, and that's why our mayor has objected to this measure as well.

Senator Elefante.

Thank you so much. Administrator, Trujillo. Yeah.

So a few questions for you currently now. What's the annual fee at the city and county of Honolulu? Is it 46?

The the so within within the motor vehicle registration, there are different pieces to it. So the in terms of the weight tax, in Honolulu, it's 7¢per pound. In terms of the annual registration fee, it is, and I don't want him to speak on it.

It's 20 it's 20 for the on the county side.

County side for 20.

And then on in and for the state fee, it's $40 And and sorry, going back to Senator Inouye's comment about was there any earmarked funds in the registration. There's also highway beautification fund for the both for the city. And for the city, it's recently went up to $10 per per vehicle annually.

So my understanding being that I came from the county council before is that the fees cannot be more than what it actually costs to process the permit application. Is that is that correct? Correct. So you're in opposition to it because this would impact revenues collected and how you do operations.

To yes. If I if I may.

Correct.

Yes. Yes.

100% correct. We have concerns that so annually right now for the state, the the per pound is less than 2¢per pound for the state weight fee for a regular passenger vehicle. Currently in the city and county of Honolulu, it's 7¢. So if we if this passed the immediately, you would have to go down to the 2¢, and that would be a drop in impact to your funding.

And that is what we're concerned about. Math, if that's the way that this is Okay.

Understood. Thank you, administrator.

Thank you very much for the opportunity.

Okay. Thank you. Any further questions? I just

I just need a follow-up. I don't understand what you're saying about the revenue cost. Yeah. Well, our land tax goes up every year. A portion of the land tax supposed to be helping with beautification and other things.

Our inner E and V for trash pickup and everything. So as that source in the air, Oahu, air area source in the area, how is it not possible that you guys cannot, not you, but, I mean, in general, how can you not have be able to budget? Oh, I mean, I'm sorry. I rephrase. I know why.

Because they got on peer raise at the City Council and the mayor. K. Now I understand. Thank you, Chair.

Thank you, Senator.

Any further questions?

I have a question. So I talked to the author of this measure, and he expressed frustration because you couldn't answer the earlier question from mister Senator Fevella about how much money is brought in, how much is itemized in all of your expenditures. Every other county except Honolulu is able to provide that. So that that's what this bill tries to get at is, right, is to hold the city and county of Honolulu accountable, which you're not. You have no idea.

The money goes into black hole, you get whatever the city allows you to get, and then that's that's how you function. That needs to be fixed. And that's what this bill does. Yeah. Thank you.

Any further questions? No. Okay. We're gonna take a brief recess before making decisions.

Thank you.

We're reconvening the joint committees between the committee on energy and intergovernmental affairs and our friends from the committee on transportation for decision making. The two chairs have conferred. We're gonna make a few substantive amendments to to this measure. Being that only the city county of Honolulu seems to be rogue on how it budgets for our roads, we are only gonna allow this bill to apply to the city and county of Honolulu.

On page six, we are going to specific specify the annual report shall be submitted no later than twenty days prior to the convening of each regular session and make technical non substantive amendments.

Any discussion? If not, Senator Chang, I'll go yes.

Chair's recommendation on HB 2022 is to pass with amendments. Chair votes yes. [Roll Call]Recommendation is adopted.

Okay. Thank you for the committee on transportation, same recommendations to pass HB 2022 House Draft 1 with amendments. Any discussions for the committee on transportation? I do want to add though for, my personal views, I'm not one to raise taxes or, to raise fees as well. I will, however, in this particular case, because I think we're already specifying that, the fees will be taken out of a certain, part of a registration and not an additional increase.

Am I correct?

Yeah. So, with that said, vice chair for the vote, recommendation is to pass with amendments.

Yeah.

Chair. Just to If I may. Chair. For discussion.

Yes. Senator, Elefante.

Yeah. It would be I'll be curious to know from the city and county of Honolulu what that data is in terms of what your annual revenue is and how you use that fees. So that would be helpful as this bill continues to progress along the process. Thank you.

Okay. Yes.

So for the vote, by Vice Chair,

Remember his name, Brandon Elefante. We have many of us. Yes, Chair goes Chair goes Aye.

Yes, not not Stanley Chang.

Okay. Yes, not Stanley Chang.

I've got that too. Okay. Chair's recommendation is to pass HB 2022 House Draft 1 with amendments. Chair and Vice Chair vote Aye. [Roll Call] Madam Chair, recommendations adopted.

Thank you. You see what happens with a day like today?

Thank you. You see what happens with a day like today?

Okay. Good afternoon. The committee on transportation on its hearing notice at 3:02.

And just to confirm it's 0:48PM on its agenda, on its hearing notice of March 22 and this is Tuesday. And just for confirmation, today we do have at least seven items. So we're going to at least limit the oral testimony to one minute, which normally I am pretty good about the two minutes, but time is of the essence today and decision making will follow, this, this agenda as well. We'll proceed with HB 16, fifteen twenty four house draft two, and this is relating to pedestrians.

This establishes that fines for pedestrian violations under chapter 291 C, HRS shall not exceed $25 It requires state and county agencies to revise applicable schedules of fines, rules, and procedures to comply with the monetary limit.

Okay? Trent, DOT.

Aloha, Chair, Vice Chair, Senator Lee. I'll be happy to do the center over Zoom. Testimony, providing comments.

Thank you. K. Thank you very much. Department of Health on Zoom.

Oh, hello. Good afternoon, Chair, Vice Chair, members of the Committee. I'm Heidi Hansen Smith for the Department of Health. The Department's gonna stand on its testimony with comments, providing comments on the public health, potential public health impacts of this measure. And we'll be here for questions.

Thank you.

Thank you very much. Judiciary. Let's see. Sends, communication with comments, Appleseed, Hawaii Appleseed Center for Law and Criminal and Economic Justice, Malia. Good to see you. Thank you.

Good to see you. Good afternoon, Chair, Vice Chair, Members of the committee. My name is Malia Bogansky testifying on behalf of Hawaii Appleseed in support of this measure. We believe current pedestrian fines are overly excessive and really vastly disproportionate to the act to the action at hand. For example, the fines and fees for crossing the street in an outside of a marked crosswalk that is $130 In comparison, speeding on Oahu, which is much more of a public safety threat.

Those fines start at $62 Many people, especially those who don't own a car and rely on walking, really cannot afford these steep fines. If left unpaid, these tickets can cascade into large consequences of debt collection, damaged credit, and court involvement. So we believe this bill is really taking the right step to mitigate the harms caused by our currently excessive pedestrian fines. Mahalo for the opportunity to testify.

I just have, did you have a chance to see the com the communication testimony from DOG? And, they raised, you know, some some concerns with regards to the $25 you know, and they have data that shows that they've been, significant jaywalkers as well as casualties, on this measure. So just a little concerning of the low rate, the lowest to $25 How do you feel about that though?

Because they're, you know, they have the data and they're they're the ones that are upfront about ensuring that, you know, pedestrians are safe as well.

Yeah. I think for Hawaii Appleseed, of course, public safety and pedestrian safety is a big concern for us. We also recognize that a lot of people who walk, it is out of necessity. People may not have access to a car, to get around. So, for people receiving pedestrian fines like this, we just think putting that barrier.

Of these fines, a $130 is a lot of money, especially when compared to fines for people who are driving, like speeding. We just think lowering that amount is really the right step.

Yeah. Something brought to mind this morning. I lived in Chinatown. It was very interesting at Mauna Kea right across of the, China, the, Chinese Cultural Plaza Garage. And lo and behold, I saw many police cars, but it was an incident not related to any jaywalkers, but the police cars were down near the below the entry to the Cultural Center garage.

But in the meantime, all our neighbors from the other condominiums were all crossing over, just jaywalking. And I was kind of like surprised because there is no enforcement. And so that was kind of sad that, you know, we continue to have this. But since you're here members, any questions for, for Apple C? Yes.

Yes. Senator Lee.

Thanks. Just, I had two questions. One, speaking of the data, Department of Health's testimony notes that laws criminalizing pedestrians are ineffective at producing roadway safety results and it cites stats from Virginia, Kansas City, Denver, California, and others, California in particular, where after changing the law, traffic fatalities actually decreased by thirteen percent after having lowered ticket prices, and everything else showed no change. Is that, like, a universal thing?

Are there other is that or is that just sort of, like, a focus on a couple of key places?

I'm not familiar, so I can definitely

Well, let me ask you this way. Okay. Massachusetts has fines for the same Jaywalking kinds of things set at a dollar. And if you're a repeat offender, they get really harsh and they double the fine. But clearly, they have rates better than us. So who's right here?

Yeah. I think I think at Hawaii Appleseed, I think $25 is something that makes sense to us. And I mean, just to be clear, I think enforcement is important. I don't think our stance on this is let's reduce enforcement. I think it's just reducing that, like, financial, like, barrier and burden that that puts on people.

Okay. Thanks. Yeah. Thank you. Thanks, Chair.

Thank you. Yes. Thank you. Hawaii Bicycling Week, Eduardo is pretty much always here in person, sense communication in support. How about, Afo?

Sense communication in support, ACLU as well. And the support from William Peron, Jonathan Hoon, and Jonathan Lott. Is there anyone else who wishes to speak to 5024? K? Otherwise, we'll oh, yes.

Senator Carol

Question for DOT, Deputy Director Lee. Thank you, Madam Chair. Current currently now, the fine is a $100.

Let me double check. I think it's based I don't know.

Okay.

I think Toby or Lee, I think you're on. Do you know what the current fine is?

This is Kari in from Department of Transportation. We we the fine actually ranges oops. The fine ranges from $1.30 to and up depending on the jurisdiction. So certain counties have different rates.

Okay. And then one last question is, I know a big piece is the enforcement side to deter violators from doing that, and I can understand the advocates for the bill. But has DOT looked at maybe messaging or public service announcements, PSA to make more people aware of of jaywalking or, you know, crossing the street in that sense? That's something to consider.

Yeah. Carrie, I don't know if you know or are familiar with the attitude attitudinal surveys, or I know that we do a lot of procuring PSAs through movie theaters and on the radio, outreaching to University of Hawaii. Is this some of the one of the subjects that we do outreach on?

Yeah. So one of the things that we do ask in our behavioral survey, which I'm glad you brought up, is just how far people are willing to walk to a designated, crossing, which is important to kinda understand, like, the path of least resistance. And it shows that, actually, most people are willing to go to the appropriate spot, when surveyed. So that's like the majority, meaning more than 60%. And so we we wanna encourage everybody to use the safest crossing possible.

I think that's, you know, putting in a positive light rather than just always saying this is the fine, this is the penalty, but encouraging people to make the right decision because it's how the road is designed to keep them safe. But we are working on something like that right now, but we're just you know, PSAs are they they take a little while to produce and and get approval. So hopefully, we'll have something aired by pedestrian safety month this year.

Thank you very much, Carrie. I do wanna say one plug. For our interns, we're actually creating projects to help us with some social media reels. I know that we're not allowed to go on TikTok, but to do just a lot of safety messaging to reach different populations in addition to the public service announcements.

Okay. Great.

Thank you. Deputy director Lee. Thank you, Carrie.

In in one of the testimonies, it seems like the prices for jaywalking is between 130 and 180. And it's more than the speeding, on the red light, which is about what, 60 something dollars. So there's a big gap between jaywalking and other, fines, currently. So, I can tend to agree. It's pretty high if you're paying over a $100 for jaywalking.

It's a notification, but apparently, that's why this measure is before us. Thank you. Thank you. Yes. Senator.

Yes. Senator.

I think part of the frustration, I think, in a prior hearing on this issue that came up, as I recall earlier, was a lot of the places that we have here in Hawaii aren't designed for pedestrians. And I know DOT's been making great strides to try and change that, and obviously it's not gonna be overnight.

But in cases, like for example, we brought this up, I don't know, a couple years ago when it happened, but on Vineyard And Queen, right as you're crossing to like the Pacific Club from here.

Okay. Right?

It was like four way crosswalks and then DOT pulled one of them out. So if you're walking from the Capitol to the Pacific Club now, you have to cross three different times rather than just once. And in those cases, you still see a lot of people now running across the street because I mean the way that that light is it's like five minutes right in between like all the different turn signals cycles and all that stuff.

And so how do we fix situations like that where the projects that are being done actually make it both more difficult for pedestrians and to some extent more dangerous because you now have three times the exposure to getting hit by a car. While at the same time then, you know, with this situation having like harsh penalties that especially for people who can't afford it.

I mean, it's basically, like, do you take your life into your hands or do you end up paying? Right. How do we fix that?

So I don't know that particular intersection, whether it was an engineering survey that maybe I mean, I think sometimes when signal crosswalks are dangerous, maybe that's why I don't know that particular one. But I can get back to you. But I'm sorry. What is the question?

Oh, another thing. I was just making a point that this is dangerous.

Oh, okay.

Jade had said at a a prison public presentation that it was probably not in pedestrians interests and was not, yeah, I guess best practice. So anyway, I raised that as sort of the example to note that these kinds of situations, like some people are forced into it and they don't have a choice. And so if we're gonna like, how do we create a pathway where people can still reasonably get around without having to face the specter of tons.

Yeah. Yeah. Particularly where they're, you know, now we're creating a lot more affordable apartments, rentals, part of affordable housing where you we increase population in certain blocks. As an example, what I just talked about with the affordable housing within Chinatown up to as an example, the area I talked about was Beretania and Mauna Kea. And then if you're going the other way up to Vineyard, the next traffic, I mean, the next pedestrian crosswalk is on Kukui.

So because of the nature of those living in the area, which are more Asian, affordable housing, you know, there, I see it every day, but maybe add another crosswalk, right? Where in between the two intersections that there is, an, you know, the ability for them to learn that they must use a crosswalk. So, you know, add that. And also we have to, and unfortunately, city and county are the counties are involved with the traffic light management system that you that we, the state DOT pays for.

Right.

But sometimes the lights are gotta be in sync as well. Yeah. Okay. Thank you. Alright.

Anyone wishing to speak to HB 1524 is here. So we'll say Aloha and we'll go to HB 1688. And this is relating to the general excise tax exemption for aircraft maintenance, as well. And we got, Department of Taxation. Thank you for bearing with us today.

Good afternoon, Chair, Vice Chair, the University of Arizona, Department of Taxation. We'll stand on our in your testimony, friend, comments, and I'm here if you have questions.

And thank you for being here when we heard the the Senate version as well. Appreciate it. Tax foundation of Hawaii. Aloha, Tom. Good to see you again.

Yeah. Thank you, Chair, Vice Chair, Members of the committee, Tom Yamachika from Tax Foundation. We have submitted written comments. We'll send them those and be available for questions.

Okay. Thank you, Tom. Okay. Alaska Airlines and Hawaiian Airlines. Okay.

Thank you. Thank you very much. Kohala Coast Resort Association, in support, Chamber of Commerce in support. And we got, testifying for activities and attractions association of Hawaii, Antoinette Davis in support, comments from Johnny May Perry and in opposition, Theodore Metros. Is there anyone else wishes to speak on HB 1688?

Aloha.

I'm David from Metros. Oh. I'm speaking. Aloha. Hi.

Thank you for your patience as well today.

Sure. I just wanted to say that, this is a special exemption that I don't believe is any longer needed. I mean, we're talking about losing our income tax deductions. We're talking about raising our weight wages for cars. This tax exemption is really unnecessary at this point.

Why are they getting this special treatment? There's ample opportunity to tax them. This is a locked in market. The justification for doing this taxation has long since passed. This is actually an area where the state has the ability to collect some revenues rather than trying to tap all these new venues.

The airlines oppose the taxation, and yet they are first in line to ask for tax credits for sustainable aviation fuel costing hundreds of millions of dollars, but they don't wanna cover their own business operation. Thank you.

Okay. Thank you very much, for your attendance. I, can speak to some, consideration, for support for the airlines. And just to let you know as well, in Hawaii, pretty much I think Hawaiian airlines, when they built the, construction, facility for maintaining, their aircraft, at that time, we talked about the state, DOT and airports allowing them to, to actually rebuild or build an aircraft maintenance building. And one of the things was discussed was that maintenance for the aircraft can be anywhere in The United States.

And if they so choose, they could have their maintenance, and reconstruction of an aircraft, elsewhere.

And, one of the decisions we decided to support is because there are other airlines that also come into Hawaii, the aircrafts, but also to maintain, their, the use of, the facility at Hawaiian and Alaska under the jurisdiction right now that they can use the facility and make sure that the jobs are created and increase actually being increased workers, on the maintenance facility as well.

And so hopefully, other airlines, have been using, the facilities for maintenance of their aircrafts instead of probably doing it, in Las Vegas or California, that the opportunity is here in Hawaii. Just to add that, did, so hopefully, things, will continue to work out for the aircrafts, maintenance program in Hawaii. Anyone else wishes to speak to HB 1688? Hearing none, let's proceed to HB sixteen ninety one.

And this is authorizing supporting documents used to transfer ownership of a motor vehicle to an insurance company after paying, payment of damages from the result of a total loss insurance settlement to be signed electronically. K. K. City and County of Honolulu.

Hi,

Yes. Thank you. Thank you very much. On Zoom, Copart Inc, Mark Binder.

Aloha. Good afternoon. I just wanna I we have written testimony I'd like you to refer to and to to respect your time and to be sure. I just wanna say that this is a benefit to consumers as well as to the business community. We ask that you respectfully support this bill as described in our testimony with an amendment setting the effective date to 07/01/2027.

This, date was requested by one of the counties, and so we're willing to, respect that request. Thank you for the time, and I can answer any questions.

And I guess I assume that it was to give them time to get their, process, going and managing the change?

Yes. That was my understanding. Correct.

Okay. Thank you. Thank you very much. Hawaii Juris Council. Thank you, Mike or Mark.

And this is not Mike, Mike Onofredi, Hawaii Insurance Council. Okay. American Property Casualty Insurance Association, in support. Is there anyone else wishes to speak to HB 1691? Let's proceed then to HB 1692 and this is relating to traffic safety, and this requires drivers approaching stationary vehicles, displaying warning signals to slow down and make a lane change if possible and safe, to do this.

And it prohibits the operation of a pickup truck with a passenger seated in the bed or load carrying area on roadways. And for those that did, hear this measure prior, like the Senate version, the Senate version did not have the use of the pickup truck into this measure, but this is the House measure, and we'd like to hear from the Attorney General's office. Aloha.

Thanks, Michael.

Thank you. Good afternoon, Chair, Vice Chair, and committee Member. Michael Moyama, the Deputy Attorney General. The department supports this bill, which requires drivers to slow down when approaching a stationary vehicle. But I have to apologize.

I have a mistake in my written testimony that was submitted to the committee. HD 2 already includes the term vehicular warning signs. So please disregard my recommendation to add that term to HD 2. The department does recommend that the duty to slow down be simplified to increase enforceability.

The department's recommendation regarding the requirement to change lanes if possible and safe and to stop if necessary on page two, line 19 through page three, line 10, is to have HB 1692, HD 2, match the language of the companion bill, SB 2026.

That's the

Senate version?

Senate version. Yes.

Okay. But but you'll still stand on your amendment recommendation for Yes. A house hunter?

Yes.

Oh, okay. Alright. And you had on on the 291 c 27?

Yes.

Okay. Alright. Thank you so much. Thank you. Any questions for the attorney general's office?

Alright. DOT DOT on 1692.

The duty stands on a routine testimony to clear this measure and answer your questions. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Keiki Injury Prevention Coalition. Okay. In support, Aloha Independent Living, Hawaii AMPO, all in support, AAA in support and Chad Tani Gucci, an individual. I know he is very, let's see, a member of the bicycling league in support.

Is there anyone else wishing to speak to us? HB 1692? Yes. Senator Alafani.

Question for DOT, please. Yeah. So deputy director of Lee. So on this, I know HDOT in the past has done PSAs on this. I think a big part of that is also PSAs, but also enforcement.

So is this something that DOT can work with HPD and the different county police departments and DLE on enforcement of that? Because I know when you go to other states on the continent, you know, people know what some of those laws are to move over, slow down. But in Hawaii, it's a little different when it comes to situations like this.

Yes. Absolutely. So we had our transportation summit a couple of months ago, and we met a group. And I apologize. I can't remember what they were called, but they are very active in this move over law.

And, yeah, that's definitely something that we can help with with ours counterparts or our enforcement agencies to enforce.

Okay. Great. Thank you. Thank you, madam chair.

Okay. But you know, oftentimes though on on the freeway here, if there's the stationary vehicles, with the warning signals, It's the contractors that are doing the work on the freeway.

And normally it's when we're driving, and I'm just as a driver, like everybody else in this room when you're heading into downtown and all of a sudden, oh, there's, you know, the the the lights that's spinning on the on the on the vehicle with the warning that that particular lane is closed, but it's oftentimes just last minute. So what do you do in that kind of cases?

Because we're we're saying, you know, we we gotta slow down and make a lane change, but you don't make a lane change until you get to the point where you see this vehicle with the lights allowing you or telling you to change.

So Right. Yeah. I think the measure,

it allows for when it when it's when it's safe. So I think only when it's feasible for safety.

Okay. So, like, if there's an accident or something. Yes. Make a lane change. Okay.

Yeah. Alright. Well, I just wanna be sure. Sometimes we create bills and we really don't understand it. And I'd like to make sure that we all understand what we're passing, you know, to make sure everyone knows that there's a statute requirement and, and here the, I'm so happy though, that DOT now has its warning or a warning, I would say displays on the freeways, like, you know, certain freeway up somewhere else is, is, is, blocked or something and please change.

And, and I think that should continue. Yes. But I don't see that too often in many other areas. Like I see it coming down from, let's say, on H 1, you know, from coming into town, there's that warning signal that I noticed they put on when you make the change on going to Vineyard. You know, that's a to me, I think, just a wonderful sign to know that there's something happening, you know, before that.

So I hope that you'll continue, you know, in other areas for alerts. Because sometimes we don't know what's happening in an off ramp or, you know, another area. Like, I noticed recently on Punchbowl, I think, there was one, and and it could be on a on a rainy, crazy day, you know, over the week weekend. Coming out of Punchbowl going on to the freeway, and going everybody had to turn left on Vineyard. So if you're going up to the tunnel, I'm on Punchbowl.

It was crazy because some of the cars were still coming on ramp off Punchbowl. So that cars were coming down. You couldn't take a right lane going onto the onto the freeway, but you had to make a left on Vineyard. That was kind of scary, but I guess you all did what we had to do because of the the, weather, I guess. Okay.

But anyway Okay. So it's good to have some warning signs around. Okay. Thank you. But get that The

message the portable message signs.

Yeah.

Okay. That's great. Great to have. Good job on that. Thank you.

Okay. Aloha Independent Living Hawaii, Leland Brady, in support. Ampou, I think I did call that. Am I going into the right direction? That was 1692.

Okay. Okay. Yes. Alright. Okay.

Let's go, say aloha to 1692 and move to HB 2030. And this is relating to transportation affordability, and, taxation, DOT.

Good afternoon again, Harrison from Department of Taxation. We'll stand on our written testimony for any difference. And I'm available if you have any questions. Thank you.

Okay. Your your testimony on this was similarly to, the version we heard in the Senate as well. And then if you can, help us clear this, because it's kind of like a heavy bill. Okay. And you talked about the different sections, right?

I think, at least on this bill, our big concern was just the allocation of funds. Because tax systems are set up to be kind of back end after the fact. So after tax returns are submitted, then you start working on it. And so it makes it very difficult because things don't match up and you have to go through the whole process of trying to figure that out, which can take time and sometimes years depending on what's going on.

So, yeah, on this bill, we were just asking that it would be a lot easier and simpler and time efficient to make a, you know, like a lump sum allocation instead of making it based on revenues specifically related to this.

So that was our main concern. And then again, on top of that, when people report on their GET, they lump sum everything together, and we don't always have a breakout and be able to tell what's related to what. So it makes it difficult to Understand. Allocate funds specifically, related to things and and make them deposit, if that makes sense.

Okay. And also asking for, an additional time.

Yeah. That was a great question.

And get the department to, I guess, create or add a person that just will be dealing with this. It's kind of it won't be easy, I'm sure. No. Okay. Alright.

Yeah. And just update the forms and do all that. It seems like it would be simple, but the form process takes a while.

Well, I don't know about updating the form. I think you have to create a form, right? For specific issue?

Yeah. For deposits.

Okay.

Yeah. And then we have a new new to us at least where we have to make them all ADA compliant, which is a whole another process that adds on to all the the forms. So it just takes longer than you would think.

Okay. We're almost close to half of the 2026 discount. And you're asking for January 2027, but is that enough time?

It usually is. We usually try to get all the forms prepared, updated and changed by like September, October in that area. So we've always been able to do it.

Well, if it's best as well. Okay. Alright. Not the easy job. Okay. State Energy Office.

Thank you.

Okay. To your question,

mister. We stand on our written testimony and support.

Okay. Thank you. Thank you very much. On Zoom, Hawaii State Youth Commission.

Aloha. The Hawaii state youth commission stands in our written testimony in strong support of this measure. Mahalo.

Great. Thank you very much. City and county of Honolulu. Okay. In support county of Kauai in support, auto dealers association.

Aloha, Melissa.

Aloha. My name is Melissa Pavlicek. I serve as the Executive Director for the Hawaii Automobile Dealers Association, which represents 71 new car dealers in Hawaii and over 4,000 jobs, directly and indirectly in our dealerships. We work closely with the Hawaii State Energy Office, the Department of Transportation, and support the transition to renewable fuels. We respectfully oppose this measure.

One of the purposes of this bill is to address rural and low income costs of transportation. We believe that this bill will actually because it applies to all Hawaii residents who even those who share one primary vehicle, those one primary vehicles in a family tend to be midsize or larger or SUVs, which can be more costly. Think, for example, cars such as a Chevrolet Traverse or Tahoe. These are more expensive vehicles that are not, by any stretch of the imagination, a luxury vehicle.

In addition, the Hawaii small business economy is composed of many small businesses and solo sole proprietors.

They often operate vehicles such as a Toyota Tacoma construction trades and unionized workforce members. And those who work in jobs that require transporting things often purchase larger vehicles, including SUVs. So these are the people that would be affected most by this funding for the tax relief or for the credit I'm sorry, the rebate for EVs. Please don't get me wrong. New car dealers sell electric vehicles.

We support the transition to electric vehicles. I am often struck when I go to national conferences by how Hawaii has a large larger percentage of adoption of EVs than many other states. But still, in all, 93% of Hawaii residents, purchase and drive, internal combustion engine vehicles. We want to support the transition to EVs, but we feel that this will unintentionally hurt those who purchase other vehicles. Thank you.

Okay. Well, this was kind of confusing at the beginning. If you would look at the bill and understand, the unintended consequences And if all of our islands are so different, I come from an area on the big island where we have, we don't have a, the base like Oahu. Because Oahu has the largest EV cars within the state so far. And the consequences are pretty much more on the average middle class people, low income, and those that use vehicles for fishing and hunting and everything else.

But I, you know, it's, it differs. That's, interesting that, you know, when we see the benefits. At one time, matter of fact, it was my bill when Evie starting and my colleague over here, who's in the Senate was the chair of energy in the house and I chaired in energy and we did give relief to EV purchases. I think it was $50 or something like that to their registration.

We also gave them an opportunity to to park at the airport in a way, free at one time.

And it didn't last that long, but all the benefits were there. And not to say that I oppose EV purchasing, but it certainly does not apply to many in our population. Senator Elefante.

Hi, miss Pavlicek. Do you have any data from HADA and EV sales in comparison to gas

Yes. Vehicles?

Yes. We produce a quarterly auto outlook, which I'd be glad to share with the chair, and you can distribute it to the committee. We track not just EV sales, but all sales of light duty vehicles in the state, including by brand. And you'll see some interesting data. And as chair Inouye pointed out, the islands do have different adoption rates.

But one of the reasons for that, when chair Lee was, the transportation chair, we often supported bills to, increase and promote infrastructure. So for those who need charging stations and Oahu is a double edged sword. We have a high degree of, units that are multifamily units and high rises, and it's often difficult for those to find charging at their residence. Yeah. But I'd be glad to share that, yeah, by the end of today.

Thank you, Sarah. I'll very much. Yes. Senator Lee.

K.

Thanks. Thanks. Just looking at your testimony, and some of the other testifiers, totally get the the affordability argument and concerns there. Obviously, we all live in areas where that's that's a big deal. One of the things that's pointed out here is that switching on average, let's say, for your typical driver from, typical gas car to EV here in Hawaii.

Well, actually on Oahu, you can say between 4 to $5,000 per year for that owner. Right? And that's compounded over the life of the vehicle. Let's say you're even just taking it to warranty. So five years is like $20,000 let's say conservatively.

Wouldn't that from an affordability perspective have value if even it means there's a few thousand dollars more upfront you're paying for a slightly more capable

vehicle? It might just depend on what size of vehicle is available and you need for, you know, what you're purchasing it for. So if there is an EV that a a family of six can afford that needs to haul things or whatever, I'm not sure if if the math is exactly as you said. But, I'd definitely be glad to share with you what I see in terms of sales going on now. Yeah.

Sure. And to that get back to that later, but for the moment, if there were cheaper EVs to begin with in the, let's say, 20 to $30,000 range that can fit that kind of use where you're hauling stuff around and you know that kind of thing that you're referring to?

Is there actual savings? I mean I can't exactly speak to that but

I Not that there's savings but that would be an option that could then be made viable for especially low income families where you could not only save money on the front end with a cheaper vehicle that can accommodate things, but then you're saving all that money at another $20,000 for the next five years in addition to that.

I guess, Senator, what I would want you to consider, if you would, is funding that then out of the general fund. You know, it's really this double edged sword of, yes, we wanna promote adoption of EVs, but at the expense of certain vehicles. In in some of the hearings we had in the house, it was positioned as, like, on luxury vehicles or unnecessarily expensive vehicles, but these aren't necessarily luxury or, you know, unnecessarily expensive vehicles.

Sure. Well, I mean, making those available is, like, critical. Right? I mean, well, how to put in a bill last year that would bar direct sale of those kinds of cheaper vehicles? I'm thinking of, like, the upcoming slate and or a number of other vehicles in that class that fit that cheaper

We've had concerns where the dealer and franchise relationship is eroded and manufacturers compete have a contract with a dealer and then circumvent that contract to sell directly to consumers. We're not opposed to vehicles sold directly to consumers. We're just concerned when there is a dealer manufacturer relationship in place that dealers not circumvent that and compete with their own dealers. So that might unintentionally appear that we oppose smaller vehicles or certain less expensive vehicles, but it's really for a reason because of the manufacturer dealer relationship.

Sure. Sure. We can

Thank you for introducing that bill, by the way. So I know we we should have further discussion. Thank you.

Yeah. And it's kinda interesting. I have three girlfriends in Hilo. And and for some reason and some are, like, we're not part of the same group. One I'm friend with one.

I'm friend with the other one. I'm friend with the other one. And they all bought new vehicles, Lexus. But you know what? They bought the hybrids.

Yeah. And they refused to get the pure EVs. And only because the big island and its roadways, you go up the hills and down the hills and all over the place throughout the island. But interesting, but they're willing to pay, but that's okay if they can afford it, but it's nice to upgrade a vehicle that, you know, is comfortable for that particular consumer. But, yes, there's others that we must take care of as well.

Thank you so much for being here. Appreciate it. Imua Alliance.

Aloha, Chair, Vice Chair and committee Members. I'm Chris Caulfield speaking to you today as president of Imua Alliance. We're in support of this bill. As you all know, transportation is the largest source of greenhouse gas emissions in Hawaii, accounting for nearly half of our statewide emissions. And electric, that makes clean transportation all the more urgent.

And we have over 40,000 EVs on our roads right now, but affordability remains a huge concern, especially with federal changes that have eliminated EV tax credits at the federal level for working families. There was a paper that came out from Harvard University in March 2025 that shows that the elimination of those credits would reduce vehicle adoption rates nationally by at least six to 10% and contribute another 20,000,000 of carbon emissions over baseline projections by 2030. This bill helps fill that gap by creating a state rebate.

That matters tremendously for working families as was just stated. The savings on EVs from, traditional gas powered vehicles, can be up to 40% or approximately $5,000 per year.

This program has been implemented in other states. It works. In, Oregon, it's been in high demand. There's over 42,000 rebates that have been issued in Oregon, through the Oregon clean vehicle rebate program in California. EV rebate programs are in such high demand that they're often oversubscribed.

They they they can't fulfill the total number of rebates that are in demand. So, we think this is a great bill, climate resilience bill, and affordability bill, and energy energy security bill, and we hope that you will move it forward. Thank you so much.

Thank you, Chris. Abigail Ramston. Aloha. Aloha. Yep.

Rivian Automotive. Aloha.

Good afternoon. My name is Abigail Ramston, Western State Policy Lead for Rivian Automotive. As a manufacturer of electric vehicles and charging infrastructure, Rivian is pleased to support this bill. A clean vehicle rebate program is a proven policy that can catalyze clean transportation and support consumers without burdening the state budget. The state has identified vehicle fuel use as a financial and environmental burden.

This program would take an important step forward, facilitating the state's transition to clean vehicles and lowering the cost of living for Hawaii residents. As a manufacturer actively selling and servicing vehicles in Hawaii, Rivian urges the legislature to continue moving this important legislation. Based on our experience in other states, this program, offered directly to consumers with few administrative burdens, can successfully drive electric vehicle adoption.

This summer, Rivian will release a midsize SUV that can go up and down hills, and it would qualify for this program as written. We want to facilitate electric vehicle up adoption broadly and across brands.

Hawaii is in a position to lead other states and the nation in electrification and a just clean energy transition. We respectfully urge your support. Thank you.

Question.

Yeah. Happy to answer questions.

Welcome. I've never heard of Rivian here.

Okay. So who do you sell your cars to? Oh, I you said you will be releasing so you create vehicles Yes. Of another brand or something?

Oh.

This is our logo.

And we sell the cars with the kind of the googly eyes. They're around. They're around.

Okay.

Oh. They're around. Okay. Googly eyes?

They do. They're they do. Okay.

I gotta go look for a googly eye.

You are. See it, you will know exactly what I'm saying. It it looks like this.

Oh, where? At the front? Friendly. At the front?

Yeah. There's a bar that lights up at night and then two oval, like

You know, I may have seen something and I thought, what is this? Anyway So Yes. Okay. Wait now.

So we're a new brand.

Yes. Yes. But, do you have a business here and what name is it?

So our business is Rivian. Here

in Honolulu.

We have a service center in Oahu. It's on Dillingham.

Okay. But you also have a the so you're like Carter Ford and Nissan. So where are you?

So we are a California based company. Okay. We manufacture our vehicles in Illinois.

Okay.

We sell in The United States.

Okay. And you're okay. You build in Illinois under what brand?

Rivian.

Okay. Okay. Not a Ford, not a Chevrolet.

No.

Okay. Not a Lexus. And it's Rivian. Okay.

Okay. We gotta go take a tour to your facility then.

All the time.

And just for purpose of Hawaii residents, they're off road vehicles. We have a truck and an SUV. They're large

have a truck.

Yeah. They're larger vehicles.

EV or you have hybrids?

Only EV. That is all that we make.

Sorry. My Hilo people won't be able to afford the the truck.

We have a new one coming out that will be to be be between $45 and $60,000 putting it in line.

An EV, not a hybrid?

It is an EV.

Okay. Yes.

But it has a range of up to 350 miles. It's a really capable vehicle. It can go off roading. It can go through really high water because it doesn't have an engine intake. It's it's a great vehicle for Hawaii.

Okay. We'd love to see more of the

for the Google eyes. Okay. Senator Elefante.

I have a quick follow-up. So I know you mentioned in your testimony that you've worked in other states. You're based in California. Is there a similar program in the state of California that does something like this?

There is.

Okay. And is it very similar to this, or did they have to restructure some other programs and how they give out rebates?

Well, it's so it's called Clean Cards for All, and it is a a low and middle income electric vehicle sales rebate that is scaled based on your income. So you substantiate your income, and then you receive a voucher from the state to bring to.

So the state funds the state funds the program.

The state funds the program.

So it's not from taxing higher

No.

Vehicle gas or diesel use. So it's it's much different than it is.

I go to the legislature every year trying to figure out how to refund this program. What the state has is the greenhouse gas reduction fund, which was created a number of years ago and is intended to take monies gathered through a cap and trade program, that is intended to try to bring, emissions down across industrial and and vehicle sectors. It takes some of that funding and puts it towards programs like this because they have a proven Right. Carbon reduction, which is what the greenhouse gas reduction fund requires.

So slightly different than this this model.

Something like this that funds itself

Right.

And, you know, could potentially have a market effect and encourage people to not only take advantage of a rebate, but look at electric vehicles as a plausible option for them can has been shown in other states like the other testifier pointed out. Okay. It really does move markets and and encourage customers to overcome their reluctance to take the dot

an l Thank you, Abigail. Sir, sir. Appreciate it.

Sorry, folks. I'm supposed to go see your car this afternoon.

I know. It's downstairs.

Okay.

You're gonna see the googly eyes.

Why is this familiar? Yes. And I see your hostess over there. And I said, oh, that's the car I'm going to see. Am I seeing a vehicle I mean, an SUV or a truck or a truck or

You're going to see a red truck.

Where is it parked?

It's downstairs.

Okay. You guys, anybody downstairs where

Anyone wants to come down and see the truck?

Downstairs on the parking garage or by the flagpole?

Okay. Underground. Red color?

Underground.

Red.

Red color. Okay. And what's the license plate?

Just the last numbers.

It's an Illinois license plate because it's a dealer car.

Illinois, why you guys wanna see that car? Okay. Anyway.

I'll park by the circle and people can come by.

Okay. Another question. You're you're saying you're gonna release a midsize SUV. Yes. Is that it it's an SUV midsize, so my SUV thinking about midsize is a Nissan Rogue.

Yeah. It's just like that. Similar size. Similar size.

Okay. I'm looking at buying a new SUV, but I'm not I don't like small cars because I golf and I like to go holo holo to the other side of the island.

So I like I have an 80 pound dog. I like 80 car SS.

Okay.

Everybody. Downstairs, you're gonna take it for a test drive.

Okay. Test drive.

It makes for a test.

Downstairs and look at this car. Okay. Alright. And sorry. I'm It's okay.

I was thinking about why he's reviewing family. Okay. Let's go okay. Your money okay. Tax Foundation.

Tax Foundation of.

Not present on Zoom Chair.

Okay. I think he was tired. It's after 04:30. Okay. Climate Future, forum.

Sorry. We took so long. Are you still with us? Thank you, Sofia.

Yes.

Good afternoon, Chair, Vice Chair, and Members of the committee. I'm Sofia, and I serve as a youth leader of Climate Future Forum, a nonprofit organization dedicated to amplifying youth forces in the legislature to support climate policies. Through several mechanisms, HB 2030 protects and serves families who without the rebate likely could not afford an electric vehicle.

These are residents who want to participate in the decarbonization of transportation and or, experience the great financial benefits of switching to an EV such as the reduction of typical fuel and maintenance costs that they would face with a gas powered vehicle, which Senator Lee was describing earlier, I believe. CFF is not solely concerned with addressing climate change, but also making sure that the transition to a more sustainable future for our state is equitable.

This is why we support HB 2030. Thank you for the opportunity to testify. And on behalf of the youth of climate future forum, we respectfully urge the committee to pass this bill.

Okay. Thank you very much. Is there anyone else wishes to speak to, HB 2,030? We got, auto Alliance for Automotive Innovation. Tiffany.

Tiffany. Chair, Vice Chair, Members of the committee, Tiffany Ajima on behalf of the Alliance for Automotive Innovation. The Alliance for Automotive Innovation represents 99% of the automobile manufacturers who are part of the dealer manufacturer network. We are concerned with this bill. This bill is designed as a fee bait, which penalizes the purchasers of gas vehicles and diesel vehicles in order to subsidize the purchasers of electric vehicles. No state has passed a fee bait.

In fact, multiple states, including California three times, has rejected a fee bait since 2009. The countries that did have a fee bait have since repealed them. So if Hawaii were to pass this bill, we would be standing alone, in adopting a failed model. Fee bait policies can worsen the vehicle affordability of crisis, raising costs for families and, who are already facing record high car prices, elevated gas prices, and limited charging access.

Working families of small businesses that rely on trucks, vans, and SUVs would face new fees, effectively taxing essential workers, for the vehicles that they drive.

We'd ask you to defer this measure. Thank you.

K. Thank you very much. HTA, Hawaii Transportation Association, Tina.

Aloha. I'm here. I don't know what's going on with my video right now.

IT. Can you,

Can you, take off the other testifier? Okay. There there we go, Tina.

Okay.

So we respectfully oppose this bill for a number of reasons. A lot of people don't realize, but transportation companies do use light vehicles. And it's very expensive to transition over because the infrastructure is not there. And putting in chargers is not as simple. A lot of places don't have the electrical pull, so we would have to put in new transformers, and that gonna cost us hundreds of thousands of dollars that we just don't have.

And if we do do it, it is gonna be passed on to our customers, which are the retailers, and the retailers will be then passing it on to the customers, which are the consumers. So we are very concerned about this bill. It does have an impact on all of us, and we get it that we all wanna be more green, but we believe that the focus should start on infrastructure here in Hawaii first. Mahalo.

Okay. Thank you. Hawaii Youth Transportation Council. IT.

Okay. Aloha. I apologize. I a prompt came up to ask me to start my camera, so I did. So aloha.

My name is Luca Cuniberti. I'm the oh, sorry. Aloha Chair Inouye, Vice Chair Elefante, committee Members. I wanna say big mahalo for Senator Lee for really standing behind electric vehicles during this committee meeting. My name is Luca Kinabariti, a North Shore Wahoo resident and high school senior, as well as the HYTC's policy and legislation chair testifying on behalf of them in strong support of HB 2030 or the clean vehicle rebate program.

This bill will allow every Hawaii resident to be able to afford electric vehicles while the youth council would prefer people use public transportation. The reality is that according to the 2020 census, 13.9% of Hawaii residents live in rural areas that public transit may not reach, or they have a line of work that was, talked about before that requires the use of heavy duty vehicles. These residents need a renewable and affordable vehicle option. That is what this bill would allow.

Electric vehicles are a primary point in bringing down our greenhouse emissions and the fight against climate change, something that has been more than apparent in our state in the last few weeks and particularly in my community.

I was off island

during this week. Time. Okay. Times are off. Yeah.

I'm sorry. Okay. Thanks.

I'm sorry. I'm not a a paid lobbyist.

Oh, thank you. Testifying for the Institute of Transportation Studies, University of California, Davis.

Aloha Chair, Vice Chair, and certainly, my name is Dr. Aditya Ramji. I'm from the Institute of Transportation Studies. At the outside, we support the bill and, and stand by their testimony. I would like to also offer, some factual corrections on the information that has been provided to you today.

The state of California that has been used as an example, just to highlight that the reason the state of California does not have a tax to own gas cars is because the state of California has, by law, a mandate for every automobile manufacturer to sell an increasing number of EVs every year, in the state of California.

That makes sure that auto manufacturers have to internally adjust for their investments and pricing. If you do not have a mandate, the alternative would have been the fee. I and on the other hand, the state of California continues to provide rebate programs that are very similar to the design that has been presented in this bill. And so I in in in that in that same vein, as far as Hawaii is concerned, we've been looking at Hawaii data.

70% of Hawaii's new gas cars have a fuel efficiency of less than 30 miles per gallon and are actually costing more than 20% above more efficient gas cars themselves.

And so we and the second fact is that the bill actually does not impose a penalty on all households buying gas cars. It only imposes the bill on on about 40% of new gas car buyers. So just to make sure that

Thank you. You got detail. Your your times is up, but I have one question for you. Yes. California does not have a a special fund.

It's coming out of the general fund to offer a rebate to customers. Am I correct?

The the the general fund is drawing from the cap and trade program that was that was highlighted by the by Abigail from Rivian. The that is a tax, and that is a carbon tax that is imposed in the state. We just are imposing that across the economy, and and we collect that money and fund the rebate program. In this case, it is much more targeted. It is just taking from gap more polluting gas cars and redistributing that to new EVs.

Thank you.

Thank thanks for being with us today.

Thank you.

Okay. Earthjustice. Thanks for bearing with us, Isaac.

Thank you.

Just to let you know, we're going to try to speed this up because I understand I need to get out of here. We need to get out of here by five. Okay. So we'll try to hurry up.

Okay. Thank you Chair, Vice Chair, Members of the committee. Stand on our written testimony in strong support. We appreciate the support and collaboration of Hawaii Department of Transportation, who I believe have also submitted testimony.

We have proposed amendments and we're united on that. So, yeah, gas cars and affordability crisis. And this gas prices right now is just the latest reminder. This is a self funding revenue neutral solution to open up cleaner and cheaper options. This bill is all about affordability in its title and every single provision.

Right? Now, you know, I I I don't know if I'm gonna have enough as much time as the auto dealers to respond to some of their points, but responding to HADA, well, you know, this is the way we help lower income customers. And in terms of auto innovators, let's innovate. Right? And, really, there was a lot of misinformation in their testimony.

Especially in a major state budget crisis, this self funded program is really the solution to move us forward, and it's investment in the present and the future. Available for any questions. And doctor Aditya, Ranji is also available too. He's a really, an encyclopedia of knowledge, and he's helped put together these numbers, which, by the way, we can customize the numbers however we want. But I think as Chair Keeler said in the House side, you know, everyone can complain, but let's focus on solutions.

So we urge the committee to pass this bill through so we can talk about solutions. Mahalo.

Thank you, Isaac. A question for Isaac. Question.

So I I appreciate your hard work. I think it's a creative way of looking at how do you get more people to use EV. But I know California is a little different than this. So was that ever explored or looked at to see what they do in California across the board and that proposal rather than something like like this per se?

Thank you, vice chair. So, actually, the rebate side of this program very much patterns after California very much also mirrors the former federal tax credit. So, yeah, this is kind of best practice in many, many states, and Hawaii is kinda lagging in that regard. Now with regards to the funding mechanism, as doctor Ramji explained, in California, they have a mandate. Right?

And so if you wanna go the mandate route, I know we don't wanna ban cars or whatever, tell people they can't buy their gas cars. But, you know, other than that, you know, our options to really drive this forward, you can count on on a couple fingers. Right? Are you gonna mandate it? Are you gonna ban?

Or are you gonna give sort of that market based nudge or that incentive? Not saying you cannot buy your expensive gas car. If you want that, certainly it's possible.

Okay.

But, you know, for more expensive options, why don't you help lower income people save money on

gas? Thank you. Yeah. Thanks, Isaac. Okay.

IT, thank you.

Okay.

IT, we have several on Zoom. I'm going to hurry this up is, let's see. Is Charlotte Maiden there on, on zoom?

Aloha. Hello. Aloha Chair, Vice Chair, and Members of the committee. My my name is Charlotte Maiden. I live in Kailua and I'm a junior at university laboratory school.

I am testifying in strong support of HB 2030 HD 2, which establishes Hawaii's clean vehicle rebate program. Transportation is the largest source of pollution in Hawaii accounting for more than half of our statewide emissions. And our state spends billions each year importing gasoline and diesel, hurting our local economy and contributing to climate change and public health harms. This bill creates a revenue neutral rebate program to lower the upfront cost of new and use electric vehicles for Hawaii residents, letting more of our community

I'm sorry. Can you kind of summarize because I need to cut the we got three more waiting at Zoom in, and time is not in our favor today. So but we appreciate we appreciate your testimony.

Okay. This bill ensures that working families, not just the wealthy, can enjoy the financial and health benefits of EVs. Okay. Yeah. I thank you very much.

All right. Noel Morin, if you can summarize, we're gonna cut back the one minute to at least a half a minute, but

Yes. Can you hear me okay?

If you support or oppose, And if you support, we've heard many testifiers already, and you may have heard them as well. So if you can summarize, please.

Yeah. Can you can you see me and hear me?

We can see you. Yes.

Thank you. Okay. Yes. Aloha, Noah Moran. I live in Hilo on the board of Hawaii EV, and I've driven electric since 2011. I am in strong support of this measure, and I stand by the testimony that I've submitted. Maholo.

Thank you very much. Thanks, Don. Okay. Mia Nishiguchi.

Not on Zoom, Chair.

Did she say not also?

Not on Zoom.

Not on Zoom. Okay. Nicholas Nishimura.

Not present as well.

Okay. Ron Riley. Yeah. Okay. That's.

Can you hear me?

Okay. Yes.

Yeah. Thank you. I'm from Volcano Village on Hawaii Island, and I just summarized

Nick, what was his name? Ron, is that your name? Okay. Thank you. Alright. There we go. If you can summarize, please, we're we need to get going with making doing our votes, and we got two more bills before us. I have to hurry. Are you in support or oppose?

I'm a supporter of the bill, and I'd just like to mention the co benefits of reduced air pollution and reduced medical costs, and those accrue to all Hawaii residents, especially youth in Kupuna who live close by to the pollution from our transportation, corridors. Thank you. Mahalo nui.

Okay. Thank you. Thank you so much. Is there anyone else who has been on this list that wishes to testify? Thank you.

Apologies for me to stop.

Yes. I am. My name is Ruth Robinson.

And who is this?

Ruth Robinson. I live in Hilo. I'm in, Chair Inouye's district.

Alright. Thank you.

I bought Welcome. Thank you. I bought a used, electric vehicle from the Kia dealer in Hilo in 1922. I mean, 2022 without a subsidy because I can afford it. And I want more Hawaii residents to be able to afford their own electric vehicles.

I strongly support this bill because it will increase access to EVs and help meet Hawaii's climate and energy goals. And, of course, as we all know, the Federal Government is no longer helping us with rebates for EVs.

She's not getting but she wasn't sure.

The bill's focus on equity is especially important. Electric vehicles can significantly reduce transportation costs. The hb 2030 h d two is a practical, balanced, and inclusive policy solution.

Thank you.

The past.

Thank you for your much for the for the testimony.

Thank you for being on on Zoom, and wish you well as well. Thank you so much. Mahalo. Okay. Duration.

Alright. Okay. And this is who now?

Duration.

Duration, our children's trust.