Senate Standing Committee on Agriculture and Environment

Thank you for joining us for this joint committee with the committees on energy intergovernmental affairs and our friends from the committee on agriculture and environment on this Friday, March 27 at 03:00 in Room 224. This hearing is being streamed live on YouTube. And if we have any kind of technical difficulties, we will post a reconvene. We ask that, those who are planning to testify keep their testimony to a minute. We have four measures on this agenda.

The first two being SCR 83 and SR 73, requesting the City and County of Honolulu to consider developing a facility to discard lithium ion batteries. First on our testifiers list, we have Henry Gabriel from City and County of Honolulu.

Just come up here. Yep. Okay. Welcome.

Henry Gabriel, City and County of Honolulu Department of Environmental Services. We did provide testimony on this opposing the resolution, and we stand on our testimony.

Thank you, mister Gabriel. Roger Babcock from the city and county's environmental division, I believe, might be joining us via Zoom.

Not present on Zoom, chair.

Okay. Is there anyone else wishing to testify on SCR 83 as well as SR 73. Yes. Please, join us.

Hello, dear chair, vice chair, and members of the committee. So my name is Michael Cooney, and I'm the author of four technical reports on the management of waste, end of life, clean energy materials with a significant focus on lithium ion batteries.

The fourth report, concluded that a a stewardship structure would likely be necessary that to manage the waste streams, but it's gotta be done in concert with having a facility to shred the batteries to non battery components for the reasons of safety for shipping for ocean shipping. So we support this resolution, I support this resolution with the caveat of understanding that there's some details to work out.

But I do believe strongly, it is important to consider having a wet shredding operation on the island to handle this waste stream.

And I'm more than happy to meet anybody after this for greater briefing of what the conclusions of our reports from HEDI. Thank you.

Great. Thank you, mister Cooney. Is there anyone else wishing to testify on these two measures? If not, members, any questions? Okay. Oh, Senator Richards?

City and county. Yeah. So you spoke against this. Yes. Expand on that, please.

We we feel that the city and county, it shouldn't be, I guess, funding this I mean, we're for rechargeable recycling of rechargeable lithium batteries, all types of batteries. But to put that on the city, it just seems like something is missing. And that's where I feel either a EPR or some sort of program a stewardship program will benefit if we do do something like this. That way, they're all counties can have some sort of funding source to be able to do this.

Okay. So that's why I wanted clarification. You're not against the recycling? It's the funding of the program.

It's the funding of the program. Yes.

Okay. Alright.

Thank you. Thank you. You're welcome.

Sure. Any further questions? Okay. Great. We're gonna move on to the next two measures, those being SCR 95 and SR 90, requesting the Hawaii State Energy Office to convene a working group to study the potential impacts of large data centers on Hawaii's electrical utilities, ratepayers, natural resources, and climate goals. First on our testifiers list, we have PUC, Jon Itomura, or his representative.

Chairs, Vice Chairs, members of the committee, Andrew Okabe, speaking on behalf of Jon Itomura. I'm here for any questions you may have. We stand on our written testimony, offering comment. Thank you.

Thank you, Andrew. Hawaii State Energy Office, Mr. Yunker.

Chair, Vice Chair, members of the committee, I'm Chris Yunker with Hawaii State Energy Office. We stand on our written testimony with comments and available for questions.

Okay. That's all I have for those indicating a desire to testify. Is there anyone else in the room or online wishing to testify on these two resolutions? If not, members, any questions?

Yep. I'll go again.

Senator Richards.

Energy Office. Couple of things. First of all, you asked about a definition of large in your comments. Oh, no, I'm sorry. That's PUC. All right. Sorry. Yeah. Actually, PUC.

You wanna call us up? Okay.

Yeah. Sorry.

Okay. Thank you, Vice Chair.

Yeah.

So, definition of large?

Yeah.

So, we do-- we do suggest that the definition of large be determined by the working group itself because, you know, Hawaii, we're kind of unique on every-- even every island, that's not gonna be the same as the mainlands. You know, you're talking about hyperscalers. These things are a couple 100 megawatts big. You know, that's like, 20, 30% of the grid power here, even on Oahu. That would be, like, one or two times, you know, maybe even Big Island's. But, you know, just put it bluntly, you know, we we do ask that the working group will get that, but if you wanna press me--

No, I don't. I just wanted to get the sensing where you're going because you're right. Big Island is a 200-megawatt grid, and so-- and the-- on the one hand, these data centers could bring economy, but there's a other side: energy demands and then resource demands, cooling, whatever the case may be.

Yes.

So-- okay. All right. Thank you. Thank you, Chair.

I have one question. I'm looking at the composition of this working group--

--and heavy government and HECO's on here. Would it be prudent for us to add someone from the, you know, the IPPs, the actual renewable energy developer on this working group? Would that be someone additive to the group?

Yes.

If you're-- if you think that these hyperscalers or even a regular data center would need to pursue additional energy resources, so we don't wanna-- because we don't wanna burden the grid, it may be a good idea to definitely do that. I'm not sure how you would select a single representative from that group. I don't know if there's a trade group or maybe there's an attorney you can tap from that have represented several IPPs, but maybe that would be a good idea because they're very well-knowledged about, you know, how to bring the resources online that we need to run, you know, electric grid.

Okay. Great. Thank you, Andrew. Is there anyone else wishing to ask questions? If not, might we do Four? Okay.

Thank you. Thank you. The two chairs have conferred and would like to move these four resolutions out. On the first pair, Senate concurrent Resolution 83 and Senate Resolution 73. Understand the city's concerns, but there's a huge environmental issue that this resolution tried to get at for the proper disposal of lithium ion batteries.

So I'd like to encourage the city to take a really deeper dive into how and what role it plays in the proper disposal of these batteries. So chairs two chairs have recommended our recommendation is to pass this measure out, both these resolutions out as is. Any discussion? If not, Senator Chang, I vote yes on both resolutions.

Chair's recommendation for SCR 83 and SR 73 is to pass unamended. Chair LoCai votes aye. Vice Chair Chang votes aye. Senator DeCoite is excused. Senator Richards. Aye. Senator Fevella is excused. The recommendation is adopted. Thank you.

Same recommendation for AEN. And any discussion? Chair votes aye on both measures.

Okay. On SCR 83 and SR 73, Recommendation is to pass unamended. Chair votes aye. Vice Chair votes aye. Senator Coit is excused. Senator Rhoads? Aye. Senator Awais is excused. We are voting on both measures. Okay. Chair, both have passed.

Thank you, .

Okay. On the next pair of resolutions, SCR 95 and SR 90. This is having the State Energy Office create a working group to see where Hawaii's role is in the future of data centers and making sure that, if we go down this road, we have enough juice to power these data centers.

I would like to make a number of amendments to the resolution. First being that we'd like to add an energy developer who's familiar with data centers into the working group, and take all five of the PUC's recommended amendments. Any discussion? If not, Senator Chang, I vote yes on both resolutions.

Chair's recommendation for SCR 95 to SCR 90 is to pass with amendments. Of the Members present, are there any objections or reservations? Seeing none. The recommendation is adopted.

Same recommendation for AEN. Any discussion? Chair votes aye on both measures.

On SCR 95 and SR 90, recommendations are pass with amendments. Of the three Members in attendance, anybody voting with reservations? Any no votes? Chair, both have passed.

Thank you, Members.

Great. Thank you. Have a wonderful weekend. We are adjourned.

Aloha mai kākou. And good afternoon. Mahalo for joining today's AEN hearing. It's Friday, March 27, and we're convened in Room 224 and video conferencing, which includes the audio and video of remote participants that's being streamed live on YouTube.

In the unlikely event that this hearing is cut short, the committee will reconvene to discuss any outstanding business on Monday, March 30 at 3:10pm here in Room 227 during AEN's time slot. And a public notice will be posted on the legislature's website.

There will be a two-minute time limit for all testifiers, and we have a virtual countdown timer on the Zoom screen. So we'll start off with SCR 71 and SR 66, urging this body to introduce and pass legislation to establish strict liability for individuals who keep, harbor, or feed certain animals in a manner that results in damage to property. First up is DAB.

Aloha, Chair, Vice Chair, Committee Member Rhoads, Senator Rhoads. Department of Agriculture and Biosecurity. We stand on our written testimony in support.

Okay. And do we have anyone else to testify on this measure? Okay. We have-- any questions? We have two in support, three opposed.

Moving on to the next measure. Let's see here. And that's SCR 120, urging the state to consider the importance of rangelands and pastoralists, and adopt policies that further sustain rangeland health and pastoralist livelihoods. Okay. First up is DAB.

DAB stands on its written testimony in support.

Anyone else wishing to testify on this measure? Any questions? Four in support, zero opposed. One comment.

And moving on to the final two measures, SCR 129 and SR 121, affirming support for the expansion of programs and projects that increase tree canopy coverage and install shade trees in urban areas to mitigate the effects of urban heat islands across the state. Let's see. First up is Chris Caulfield, Hawaii Public Health Institute. Hello, Chris.

Aloha. Good afternoon, Chair, Vice Chair Richards, Senator Rhoads. I'm Chris Caulfield from the Hawaii Public Health Institute. We're in support of this resolution. Urban heat islands are already making cities significantly hotter here and on the mainland. Urban areas can be several degrees hotter than nearby rural areas, which increases the risk of heat illness, energy costs, and climate impacts, especially for kupuna and keiki who are very vulnerable to-- already very vulnerable to health impacts.

But studies show that a single tree can reduce surface temperatures by about 4 to 14 degrees Fahrenheit. Big surprise to me when I learned that this year. So they essentially act like a natural air conditioner. Similarly, cities with about 40% tree canopy cover can be 7 to 9 degrees cooler-- 7 to 9 degrees Fahrenheit cooler overall.

So trees help address our climate change directly. They absorb carbon dioxide, they reduce energy use by shading buildings, improve air quality, and reduce stormwater runoff, and they are just a cost-effective cooling strategy that help communities with high heat exposure, so we would love to see this resolution move forward. Thank you so much.

Thank you, Chris. Cristina De Leon from Climate Change and Health Working Group, on Zoom. Hello, Cristina.

Aloha. My name is Cristina, I'm with the Climate Change and Health Working Group, and we fully support SCR 129/SR 121. Urban heat island's effects are already increasing heat exposure across Hawaii, raising the risk of heat-related illnesses for residents. Extreme heat is a public health concern that affects keiki, kupuna, individuals with preexisting health conditions, and communities with limited access to shade and cooling resources.

Expanding tree canopy coverage is one of the most effective, nature-based solutions to reduce urban heat. Shade trees lower ambient and surface temperatures, reduce heat exposure, and provide additional co-benefits, including improved air quality, stormwater management, and mental well-being. These benefits directly contribute to healthier, more resilient communities. Recent assessments show that tree canopy coverage is not evenly distributed, with lower-income communities often experiencing less shade and higher heat exposure.

Expanding tree canopy in priority areas is a practical and equitable strategy to reduce these disparities and protect communities that are most at risk. SCR 129/SR 121 appropriately recognizes the need for collaboration across state and county agencies to assess heat vulnerability, identify priority areas, and integrate shade strategies into infrastructure, housing, and community planning. Building on existing programs such as the Kaulunani and Shade Trees for Schools, this measure supports a coordinated and scalable approach to heat mitigation. Thank you for the opportunity to testify.

Thank you, Cristina. Next is Winston Welch from the Outdoor Circle, on Zoom.

Not present on Zoom, Chair.

Okay. And how about Kialoa Mossman on Zoom?

Also not present on Zoom, Chair.

Okay. Anyone else wishing to testify? Members, any questions? Oh, please.

Aloha, kakou. I'm Heather MacMillan from DLNR. We stand on our written testimony in strong, enthusiastic support for this. I'm just encouraged by all the great testimony.

Great. Thank you, Heather. So we have nine in support and zero opposed on this measures-- these measures. I got a question for Chris.

Me too.

You have a question?

Yes. You go ahead, Chair, and then--

Chris, what agencies or partnerships do you think need to be involved to, you know, to successfully expand our urban tree canopy?

Yeah. So-- and I'll just be very frank at the outset. I'm not an expert on this. I'm learning on the fly. This is something that the Climate Change and Health Working Group at HIPHI, as well as our HEAL Coalition, has been working on.

I definitely think that the Department of Land and Natural Resources has been a leader on this when we look at the studies and the reports that have come out from DLNR, statewide assessments that have been done going back to 2013. There are county agencies, including the Department of Parks and Recreation, DOT, in terms of infrastructure built that need to, I think, be involved in interagency planning and coordination in order to make this effective.

And there are lots of really excellent nonprofit organizations that are out there doing tremendous environmental work that would support a lot of the initiatives that are being-- sort of been proposed.

There have been reports that come out really looking at the impact of shade trees on heat islands, and it's been a strategy that's been proposed in a number of county and state reports going back, like I said, to 2013, but there hasn't been the sort of funding to fund some of those initiatives and impacts. So we're trying to get some energy behind the conversation, see if this is something that we can maybe pull together some additional conversation on, get this going.

All right. Senator?

Yeah. Thanks. And, Chris, you may not have the answer, and maybe Cristina does. What I'm asking is, do you know of any data that-- I assume the more trees, the better? But then we hit a capacity where you can't have just all trees. So is there an optimum number that you know of that it becomes even more beneficial if we get from--and I don't know what the coverage might be, 10% to 20%?--is there an optimum target that we should be looking at? And if you're not aware of that, maybe Cristina has that information.

Well, there's two things. One, there's a study from the county that shows that in-- on Oahu, we're at about 19% coverage in urban areas. The number that I keep seeing cited in the research that we looked at is 40%, that number that I cited in my testimony.

Cities with 40% tree canopy coverage show that 7 to 10 degree Fahrenheit drop in cooling temperatures, so that's kind of what we're targeting is sort of this-- if we could double the amount of trees that we have in urban areas, that's sort of what we would be going for. I think that would have a tremendous impact.

Okay. That's the kind of data I was looking for, so thank you.

Thank you, Chris. Okay. We can just go ahead into decision-making.

Thank you very much.

on SCR 71, passing legislation establishing strict liability for individuals to keep harbor or feed certain animals. The chair's recommendation on this one is to pass as is. Any discussion?

Yeah, chairs. I don't usually explain my votes, but I'm gonna vote no on this one because that's always struck me as it's like reminding myself that I should pass a bill on something. And I totally agree on the the feral chickens, but I just don't know what what I don't know where it gets us. So no with reservations.

No with reservation. Okay. Alright.

Okay. Oh, yeah. Sorry. This is for SCR 71 and SR 66. Okay?

Chair votes aye. Vice chair?

Passing unamended. Chair votes aye, vice chair votes aye. Senator Rhoads, no. On both chair, you have two in favor. Motion is adopted.

Okay, thank you. And on SCR 120, to do with the importance of rangelands and pastoralists. The chair's recommendation will be to pass as is. Any discussion? Chair votes aye.

On SR 120, passing unamended, Chair votes aye. Vice Chair votes aye. Senator Rhoads? Senator Coit and Awa are excused. Chair, you have three in favor.

Motion is adopted.

Thank you, members. And then on SCR 129 and SR 121.

Firmly support for the expansion of tree projects, increasing tree canopy coverage. Chair votes, let's see. Recommendation is to pass as is. Any discussion? Chair votes aye.

On SR121, SCR129 passing unamended, Chair's recommendation is to pass as unamended. Chair votes aye. Vice Chair votes aye. Senator Rhoads? Aye. Aye and aye. Chair, you have three in favor. Motion is adopted.

And that's it. Have a good weekend everyone. Aloha.