Senate Standing Committee on Agriculture and Environment

Good afternoon.

Convening the joint committees on transportation and culture in the arts and agriculture and the environment on our 1:01pm agenda here in State Capital Conference Room 2 to 4. We have three measures up for this afternoon. We just ask everyone to limit their testimony to make sure we have an opportunity to get to everybody.

But we do have a number of folks signed up, so let's dive right in. Up first is House Bill 345, House Draft 2 relating to the state shrimp, which establishes the state shrimp. Testifying first is the Department of Land and Natural Resources. Good afternoon.

Aloha Chairs, Vice Chairs, Members of the Committee, Brian Nielson. On behalf of Department of Land and Natural Resources. We stand on our written testimony in strong support.

Thank you. Signed up to testify. Next is KUA Ina Ulu Aumo. Good afternoon.

Hi. Aloha Chairs, Vice Chairs, Committee Members. I'm Olan Le I Momi Fisher, Advocate with Kua Inaulua Wamo and we're in strong support of HB345. We helped to bring this bill forward on behalf of some of our KUA community Members that help to protect the these inky pools that house these endemic shrimp.

So we think this could be a great vehicle to better protect the shrimp and get more education and awareness going for these animals. Thank you so much for hearing it and please pass this.

Thank you. Thank you. That's everyone who had signed up to testify. Is there? We did have. Yeah. That is everyone who had signed up to testify. Is there anyone else wishing to testify in this measure? Seeing none. Are there any questions? Senator Tokoi.

Hello, Senator.

So if we designate the opailoa as the state shrimp, what would the Department do to educate the community about the significance of the designation?

So we put out a press release, you know, different education materials. We have inky line pool inventory and monitoring program so we could incorporate some of the science that we're learning from studying these pools.

But also happy to work with KUA Ina and other groups that are also supportive of this bill and work in inky line pool on different outreach materials as well.

So you guys would ask for funding then to do the education and outreach choices. Gonna be like other people contributing to help educate. I think more of the rural areas on significant impact on, you know, how they get educated because some of them educated through family lineage and cultural practices.

So what big's the difference between how you guys can do them and other cultural practitioners?

Yeah, we're not asking for any appropriation for education. We would probably just utilize our existing education programs. And partnerships to move this forward.

And that'll be statewide, though.

Statewide, yes.

Okay. Thank you. Thank you, Chair.

Any further questions? Seeing none. Thank you very much. Let's move on to the next measure or set of measures. Senate Concurrent Resolution 132 and Senate Resolution 111 encouraging the adoption of recommendations from the United Nations Global Plastics Treaty and Rapa Nui Summit Declaration to address climate justice and sustainable development.

We'll take the testimony for both of these together. And testifying first online is GreenPeace Hawaii.

Good afternoon. Okay. Aloha. Good afternoon. Dave Mullinix representing GreenPeace's thousands of supporters and members statewide. Because the worldwide movement to get us off of fossil fuels before the growing climate crisis, they are creating mixed the world unlivable. The fossil industry has been increasing plastic production to maintain their profit base.

As you may have noticed, many products used to be sold in glass are now being sold in plastic containers. Industry is also moving away from like large bottles of shampoo to individually prepackaged dispensers for shampoo to increase dramatically increasing plastic production. By 2050, scientists predict there will be more plastic in the world's ocean than fish.

Researchers found that 80% of the population already has microplastics in their bloodstream. Look to your right and to your left. Most of the people sitting in this room have already have microplastic pollution in their bloodstream. Microplastic is even showing up in mother's milk, which should be the most pure, nutritious food a human being can consume.

But even that is being threatened with plastic pollution. This is a serious problem. We don't really know the extent of what it's going to be doing to our. Is it creating cancers? We have no clue. And how much can our bodies survive with this amount of plastic in them? So I encourage you to support this.

Thank you so much for hearing it and bringing it forward. Have a wonderful day in our beautiful Hawaii. Name. Aloha.

Thank you very much. That's everyone who had signed up to testify. Is there anyone else wishing to testify on SCR132 or SR111? Seeing none. Are there any questions?

No DOH. Right? No DOH.

No doh. Does not testify. Okay. Seeing none. Let's move on to the final set of measures on the agenda.

SCR157 and SR127 urging the state to adopt the agreement under the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea on the Conservation and Sustainable Use of Marine Biological Diversity of Areas Beyond Natural Jurisdiction and support legislative, administrative and public policy. Measures to implement the agreement at the state and county levels. Do I need to repeat that?

Testifying first on these measures is Department of Land and Natural Resources. Good afternoon again.

I'm actually just read about this resolution for the first time, so I'm not sure if we submitted written testimony. If so, we stand on our written testimony. But I wasn't involved in the leading of that, so apologies.

Yes, we do have that on record. Okay, thank you. That's everyone who had signed up to testify. Is there anyone else wishing to testify in these measures? Seeing none. Are there any questions? All right. Seeing none, we're going to decision maker. Thank you, sir.

Okay, why don't we go straight into decision making on these measures, starting at the top of the agenda. House Bill 345-House- draft 2 relating to the state shrimp. Recommendation is to move this forward as. Is there any discussions? Seeing none. Acting Vice Chair for the vote.

[Roll call]

Same recommendation for AEN any discussion? Chair votes aye. Vice Chair.

[Roll call]

Thank you, Members. Thank you. Moving on to the next set of measures. Senate Concurrent Resolution 132 and Senate Resolution 111. Recommendation is to pass this with amendments, adopting the recommendation from the Energy Justice Network to change the just the terminology from waste hierarchy to zero waste hierarchy and then making technical amendments. Any discussion there? Seeing none.

Vice Chair.

Okay. Chair's recommendations to pass with amendments scr132sr1 11 of the four Members present. Any no votes or votes or reservations hearing? None. Mr. Chair. Recommendations adopted.

Same recommendation for AEN. Any discussion? Chair votes aye. Vice Chair.

Thank you. On SCR132 and SR111 passing with amendments. Chair both sides. Vice Chair, both sides. Senator Rhodes, Senator AWA excused Jury four in favor of motion is adopted.

Thank you. Thank you. And finally moving on to Senate Concurrent Resolution 157 and SR127. Recommendation to pass as is. Any discussion on this? Seeing none. Vice Chair.

Okay. Chair's recommendations to pass SCR157SR127. Unamended. Of the four Members present any no votes or votes or reservations hearing? None. Mr. Chair. Recommendations adopted.

Same recommendation for AEN any discussion? Chair votes aye. Vice Chair.

Thank you. On SCR157 SR127 with Members in attendance, are there any no votes? Any with reservation? Chair motion is adopted.

Thank you, Members. All right.

Thank you. Thank you everybody. Rejoice.

And good afternoon. Mahalo for joining today's AEN and higher ed hearing. It's Monday, March 31, 2025 and we're convened in room 224. And also video conferencing which includes the audio and video of remote participants that's being streamed live on YouTube. In an unlikely event that something happens, we have to stop the hearing.

The Committee will reconvene on Wednesday, April 21:01pm During a time slot and the public notice will be posted on the Legislature's website. And because of our 90 minute time limit for hearings, there'll be a 2 minute time limit for all testifiers.

Okay, so we are on SCR 89 and SR 72 requesting the Department of Agriculture to convene a working group to develop a plan to create an educational pathway in the University of Hawaii Community College system to equip interested students with the necessary entry level knowledge, skill set, expertise and advancement potential the field of wheat processing.

First up, we'll take both measures. Together will be the Department of Agriculture.

Good afternoon. Chairs, Vice C hairs, Members of the Committee, Cedric Gates here on behalf of the Department of Agriculture. The Department supports the intent of this measure and offers comments.

I would also like to mention that Chair Herd just met with Chancellor for Leeward Community College to discuss creating a better pipeline for our workforce with DOA to fill our vacancies. So we're looking forward to expanding that and I think this effort will continue that effort as well. Thank you.

That's great news. Thank you, Cedric. Next is Brian Miyamoto from Hawaii Farm Bureau.

The Hawaii Farm Bureau was down as frequent testimony insofar.

Thank you, Brian. Nicole Galassi from the Hawaii Cattleman's Council on Zoom.

Thank you. Chairs, Vice Chairs, Members of the Committee, we Nicole Galassi, on behalf of the Hawaii Cattleman's Council, we are in support of this measure because meat processing is a key part of the local protein supply chain. In order to increase access to local beef and address that the increasing invasive deer issue, we need skilled butchers.

We also need to recognize that the art of meat butchers is a respected career, one that ensures that we can reduce food waste, we can get local protein from pasture to plate safely. We appreciate your support of this resolution. Mahalo.

Thank you, Nicole. Anyone else wishing to either On Zoom or in person wishing to testify on these measures. Members, are there any questions?

Questions? I guess. How many jobs or careers for meat processing, field of meat processing do we anticipate.

Right now? I don't have that answer, but I can definitely get back to you.

Okay, stay there. And so with the individual that was on Zoom.

Nicole.

So, Nicole, how do we get our butchers or whoever, you know, workforce that we need in this field? How do we get them now?

How do we get them now? Right now we, we are looking for folks who are willing to put in the time and make it to the places where the meat processing facilities are. Currently, one of our largest facilities is in Kalailoa. The second largest facility is in Pauilo. Paulo is, as you know, out on the Hamakua Coast.

So they need to be able to find a place to live in order to be able to make that living as a meat processor.

Understand? But what kind of, what kind of education do they need at this point?

I actually need to get back to you on that. I'm not sure what the requirements are right now, but on the line, they can be taught to do one certain cut, to be able to be part of the line. But in our smaller facilities, our meat processes are actually expected to do a lot more.

In larger facilities, like on the continent, there's one person who does the same cut over and over and over again. But in our smaller facilities, they need to be expected to do more, have more expertise in being able to break down the carcass and that training can be done on the job.

But we want to be able to have people who are trained and know they want to be in this field and advance their career so that these are people who we know are committed to the art of butchery and will stay there for the long term.

Understand? Do we have anybody from University of Hawaii? Okay, so we don't even have, according to your folks's testimony, that there isn't no meat inspection agreement right now.

Right now the Department is in the process of establishing meat inspectors with within reorganizing our organization and redescribing some positions. But we are also working with USDA Food Safety to beef up, our pun intended, beef up our capabilities to bring on meat inspectors.

So you'll get us information as to how many actual jobs we're anticipating.

Can definitely get that back to you, Senator.

Thank you.

No problem.

That was on the screen. Sorry, I didn't get her name. Nicole. Nicole.

Yes, Senator.

Yeah. So even, even if, you know, for far as I know, the One in Kailoa, they have no. Some of them don't even have diploma or have no education background. But the plan is willing to teach them. But the thing is, what we got to put out there is that it's not a glamorous job.

Nobody really wants to do this work. You got to be a selective few that's willing to stay there for the long haul because a lot of them get the good intentions. But again, that's the thing that we got to let people know. We don't have enough areas for these guys get jobs.

And the only ones they're probably going to get jobs if they're going to do like Costco's Food Land Times. And some of them is union jobs. Right? I mean, I meet packers union, but the one you guys talking about is going to be difficult because it's not a very glamorous job.

You're exactly right, Senator. And that's kind of the reason we want to make sure we have this pathway. Because like I said earlier, people should understand that as a butcher, they are an important part of our society. We cannot have local protein without butchers.

And with these types of workers, where we're actually competing with construction with folks who would instead work in the hotel industry. So if we have a formal pathway, I think we can get the people who are of the right mind that you're talking about who, who are going to be committed to it.

Thank you. Thank you.

Yeah, just offer a few comments from my colleagues. There is a. I guess I'll call it. Nicole, you can jump in on this as well. A pilot project we just worked on with the Kauai Community College, Big Island. I think we just graduated 11 butchers.

Again, building towards that, when I was in school, some of the education that revolved around the meat sciences was anatomy as well as understanding what we're trying to get done. It's not such a high level that it's a doctorate.

It's to get an understanding of what you're trying to accomplish and what the different muscle masses do and thereby how you need to treat them. It's to give you an overview.

And as Nicole pointed out, in our smaller plants, on the large plants, you have someone that does one job repeatedly, literally hundreds, if not thousands of times, we're looking for is overall and it would serve well into our processing plants, as mentioned there, but also into our fine restaurants, the grocery stores and the supply chains, because that's a.

It's an art. And it truly is an art that has fallen out of favor And I don't disagree. We got to be upfront with them. But, but if we introduce this and have a pathway we can supply because there is a need and it's not just locally, it's nationwide, it's a problem.

Is there a degree now? You just mentioned some kind of a degree.

I think, I don't know if it's. I don't think it's a actual degree. It's not a two year degree per se. It's a education track to help at the community college level to educate them so they come out with a certain level of skill on the job.

Training is exceedingly important and I think it's to give them the bare bones to get an understanding of what they're getting into and then they go on the job training after that. That's the direction we're headed. Nicole, did you want to add anything to that?

Yeah, I would like to add that a benefit of this is going to be that when a processor is taught in the proper way, there's. That actually increases the quality of our beef at every step in the process.

There's ways where you can improve the quality or retain the quality of the beef or degrade the quality of the beef. So overall it's going to be better for our economy as well as for our consumers. Thank you.

Questions? So doa, please. So, Cedric. Senator, do we actually need this to create butchers? Only because. And no offense, my friend, only because. Is there a butcher degree?

So I would defer to, uh, regarding the curriculum. Yeah, I know.

So the reason why I asked that is because as you and I know, we kill a lot of stuff and we learn how to do butchery and so forth. So those that are in the butchery area, you know, they come on on the job training.

At the end of the day, how many slaughterhouses do we have across the State of Hawaii?

Right now, off the top of my head, I'm a Oahu boy, so I want to say the two on Oahu. Two on Oahu. And then I'm pretty sure 23 Maui.

We get two. So if we do have a pathway, how many butchers will be enough butchers, you know? You know. Yeah, I know what you're saying. Which I have no problem with, you know, supporting that industry. It's how many butchers do you get into an, into a slaughterhouse? I mean, I can see the guy that's shooting.

He's the key, he's the kill man. You go hang him up and you just like bleed them out. And then the Next guy moves over, you have the inspector that comes in, but the butcher just cuts. He doesn't do the shoot. Or maybe some of us still more. But. But you. But you know what I mean, right?

You know, so to what point will we have maximum butchers or in this case a certified. Because I've seen a lot of them. Come on.

Even if you go to Foodland or the small mom and pop stores is we usually buy the cuts and we import the cuts from the mainland, whether it be hogs, cattle, because most of us ship our cattle out in containers to go to the feedlot, unless we're doing grass fed. So how much butchers we need?

I can do my best to get back to you on about that, but off the top of my head I know that, for example, Hawaii Meats, I was able to do a tour of their facility in Kapolei Campbell.

And they use technology right now to, you know, knock the bull, for example, knocking out the, the cow before it goes to sleep. All of those things somewhat have become automated to an extent. So incorporating automation into that is important to determine how much butchers are going to need at the end of the day.

Because if there's a mixture of public and private folks that are going to be contributing to building up this workforce, that I think is going to have to be in collaboration.

So I think that'll be important for us to know because as we start to build out the portable, I think slaughterhouses, the portable slaughterhouses, again, is for the kill to go into that, to bring them back to the main slaughterhouse before we start butchering. Right, right.

You know, because you got to inspect, especially if, you know, Nicole talked about access deer. I know that we shoot it and then we take it in or the mobile slaughterhouse is there, he inspects it, it goes in and then it comes into the slaughterhouse. So again, how many butchers we're gonna need, sorry, notice your reso.

But you give me that glaring look, but you know, I mean that. I think that's the challenge for me. Okay. Because most of us have been trained to butcher things as you know, you come online or if you know, the interest is there.

Yeah, for sure. And like I said, we're going to be working with the USDA food safety folks to try to again, increase our capabilities so that we can do better market research and things of that nature to know how to best serve the ag industry.

Thank you. Thank you, Chair.

Just one thing quick. Just to address Senator DeCoite, we're actually talking about two, I think two distinct things. Not the slaughter process itself, but then taking the cuts from refining them down to actual. The portions that we're talking. And that's where the science comes into the butchery. But anyway, thank you, Chair. Okay.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Yeah. I just want to raise concerns that I have, and it's not about the industry. I certainly support the industry and understand how important this is. My concern is that we try so hard to put everything into.

You got to go to college, you got to get a degree, and so the people that aren't, and if they want to get into butchery and everything, all of a sudden, we're going to keep them out.

If they don't have a high school degree and they end up getting trained and learning how to do this, they can do it.

But once we start a pathway and, you have to have this experience, that experience, you really cut out the guise of who learn to do this and want to do it, may necessarily start out with a plan. I want to go into meat processing, or I want to become a butcher.

And so we can make excuses or reasons for why everybody should get a degree. I think a certificate, perhaps. But the other area I'm concerned about is we keep asking the education to find a pathway for this, Find a pathway for that, Find a pathway. There are so many different pathways. We cannot.

We cannot be everything to everybody. So, you know, I raise that concern at this point as to. Is this really a need at this point? I don't see people clamoring that we need to get a pathway to become. To get into this field. We don't even have Fda. What is that? Inspection, USDA inspection.

At this point, we can't even get numbers as to how many points the workforce, what's the shortage? Where's the demand? So at this point, yeah, I have serious concerns just from listening to this conversation.

I, too, am not certain, you know, whether a degree is needed or not. And I think this working group would maybe help get us there and to understand better, I'm not opposed to the resolution, but I. I do see why there is some. Not confusion, but misunderstanding or not understanding the whole process and the need for this.

Thank you.

Yeah, for. For me only because, like, I. I got to visit a few of them, and the one in Campbell, they do use people right off the street willing to do the work, willing to learn. And there's a process. You know, if you guys ever get a chance to go, you guys should.

Very clean, very automated, how to do the skinning and everything is just High tech. But when I went inside the processing area, we get people that just coming out from incarceration or whatever it is, they want a life to make a good paying job. But if we do something like this, which I think is a great idea.

Yeah, in a certain extent, but I think it might end up hurting the industry too by limiting them. So another one is right out of high school, my classmate Fu Lan was hiring. They went in there as a Clerk. Later on they went into different positions and now they're in meat cutting.

But if we're going to do all of these things and then the person not going to be able to go, but they need a certain type of pathway and we're going to hinder the ones that is eager to work.

And this is not a glamorous field, you guys, when you guys see that, you guys are going to see how much blood that has when you're doing this. But it's an art. It's an art to the craft and to the people that cut it up into oxtails to whatever kind of meat you need. It's an art.

And by hindering that, by doing something like this, I think we might hinder the growth of them being willing to come off the street and getting their hands literally dirty in movies. So I kind of get mixed feelings on this until.

Just a quick response. I think what I'm getting from my colleagues is that this is the way that we need to and it's not. The idea is to offer a pathway for people to get an education, but it's very important.

If you have someone that will train, like Senator Favela just talked about, coming out fresh out of high school, whatever, this just offers a pathway. It's a vocational training essentially is what it is. It's not about you need this degree before you can go for it. It's nothing about that. That's not the intent.

This is just to offer an education.

Thank you, chair. To me, the way this reads is that it's within the University. So if it's within the University, then to me it means higher education. And I guess that's where I was confused. Is that necessary to have a higher education degree?

You're having a hard time finding people and if they can train, you know, students out of high school.

No, I. That's where I think from my perspective, the idea is to offer through which our University of Hawaii, it's a land grant school that they offer a pathway, but it's not something that's needed to embrace the profession. It's Just to offer a way to go through it. And maybe it shouldn't say the University.

It should just be. Offer a pathway, whatever the case may be.

Zero, it says the community college system. Community college system, yeah. And it's a working group to come up with the plan.

We start off with a plan like this, and eventually people get cut out. We see that all the time. And they want them to have to have a. A license. Then you go through dcca. They're only going to allow certain. They keep people out of the profession. At this point.

I don't see why the University feels it's needed, that they can go ahead and do one. Why we have to put some kind of working group.

It's an industry looking for more butchers coming in. And it's not just the slaughter industry. It's the. Like I said, hotel, restaurant as well.

Okay, so do you want to just go into decision making now? Sure. Okay, we'll go into decision making. So the chair. The recommendation is to pass SCR 89 and SR 72. As is any discussion for AEN.

[Roll call]

Reservations.

[Roll call]

Members for HRE not pass this. So chair votes no with reservations.

No.

2 nos. One aye, a run reservation does not pass.

Okay, so.

Yes.

So the measure is deferred and that adjourns the hearing.