Senate Standing Committee on Health and Human Services

Following the joint calendar of the Health and Human Services and Judiciary 9 o'clock calendar. This meeting is being streamed live. Oh, present with me is co chair Carl Rhodes as well as co vice well Vice Chair Senator Gabard. This meeting is being streamed live on YouTube.

Your audio will be muted and video disabled for those on on zoom until shortly before it is your turn to testify. Each testifier, unlike Senator Rhodes, I am limiting my testify to one minute. Those who have come in front of me know that I'm very strict with this one minute time limit.

If there is a technical glitch during your time to testify, we may move have to move on to the next person due to time constraints. I will be reading a list of individuals who submitted written testimony for each measure. We apologize if the closed captioning does not accurately transcribe the names.

If you're interested in reviewing the written testimony, please go to the Legislator's website. You'll find a link on the status page for the measure. We appreciate your understanding and remind you that the Committee does have your testimony, that I review them.

So I encourage you to use your time to either add additional comments or you can stand on your written testimony. And like I said, I'm going to be very strict on time because today's a deadline for the lateral bills are going to die if we don't pass them today. So first up, SB709 relating to mental health.

We have Judiciary providing comments. Angie Knight, Institute of Human Services and support. Thank you very much. Alan Johnson of HSAC, Hawaii Substance Abuse Coalition and support. Okay, thank you. Edward Chu, Hawaii Health Systems Corporation, providing comments. Ellen Awai in support. Ellen, are you present? No. Gregory Misakyan in support. Ellen Gobby Carson in support.

Anybody else wishing to testify in SB 709? Come on up.

Morning, Chairs, Vice Chair. Daven Takinaka, Administrator for the Adult Mental Division here on behalf of the Department of Health, we stand on our written testimony in support of the intent and provide comments and we apologize for the late testimony.

Okay, thank you very much. Next up we have oh Members. Any questions? Okay. Senator Rhoads.

Sorry, was anybody here from the Judiciary? Okay for DOH.

Come on up. Mr. Takanaka.

Does it. Does the Department have any comments about the appropriation amounts? Either the 2.25 million for data collection and publication or the blank amount for education and training.

The Department very much appreciates the appropriation amounts. It would very much help with the maintenance of the data dashboard as well as our positions. Currently we use federal funding and as you all know, those are right now Subject to temporary status on the blank amount.

Do you have a suggested amount for that?

We do not have that at this time. All right. Okay. Thanks. Thank you.

Thanks.

Well, I have a question. Ihs, sorry. Come on up. So, according to late testimony of Department of Health, they are claiming that they already have a data dashboard using the data maintained by the Department. And so they don't believe sections 2 and 3 are necessary. Do you agree or do you. Do you know.

I mean, it's late testimony. Yeah, I see somebody standing up. Is that what I just.

No, no. She's. I think with your communications office taking photos, I can't actually speak to that. I'm not too sure. I know that there is a lot of effort to create more synchronized data. And so I think it's. If there's stuff that's already happening, we should work together to improve it. But I can't speak to their testimony.

Okay, thank you very much. I guess Department of Health, again, because of the late testimony. I mean, we were not considering the leading sections 2 and 3. What do you think about late implementation of 2 and 3 to see whether or not you folks can synchronize the data?

It seems from the way the bill is written, there are two parts to this. One is the data dashboard or the data piece, which is something that we are already doing. We have a website, a dashboard at bh808.hawaii.gov and we currently report on much of what is being asked here on the data that we maintain.

The issue that we're having is the data that we don't maintain for the second part of this. We have noticed that there hasn't been much uptake over the years on the act orders. So since last legislative session, there hasn't been much of an increase.

AG's office in Kona went from one to two petitions granted in 2023, and Oahu was one to two as well. Data from IHS, they had nine granted in 2023 and 12 in 2024. Oddly, the petitions filed went from 14 to nine. It actually reduced.

Part of it is because they were able to convince the consumers to take the medications voluntarily, which isn't something that's addressed in the Bill.

You know, I'm a psychologist by trade, and a lot of our relationships with consumers is trying to respect their autonomy in taking medications and also working with them in the way that they are part of the treatment team and part of the decision making when possible, after orders come into place, when they can't.

Okay, thank you very much. Thank you. Okay. Moving on. Oh, any other questions? Seeing none. Moving on for SB 955. Relating to. Excuse me. Relating to fitness to proceed, we have Judiciary in opposition.

Good morning Chairs, Vice Chair, Vice chairs, members of the committees. My name is Jennifer Awong. I'm the Staff Attorney for the criminal divisions of the First Circuit Court. I'm going to be very brief because our testimony is very lengthy and very detailed. We appreciate the intent of this bill.

However, Judiciary respectfully opposes portions of the bill due to the practical and perhaps unintended consequences of some of the provisions implementation. I'm available for questions.

Thank you very much. Next we have Office of the Public Defender in support.

Good morning, Chairs, Vice Chairs and members of the committee. My name is William Bento from the Office of the Public Defender. We do support the bill and the intent of the bill. We have one concern and that is taking the three panel and making them a two panel at this point in time, only adding a third evaluator if it's not the same finding by the two members

I would just want to point out that rarely is there unanimity in these three panels. And sometimes, although the findings might be the same, the reasons for the findings are different. And that's why I think traditionally it's always been three members.

Increasing the people who can qualify to be on the panel, I think will take care of the problem of the shortage. So we would ask that it be kept at a three panel. There'll be a lot of delays because there'll be a finding by the two panel.

If there's needs be a third member added, that doubles the time that's necessary for the three panel evaluation. So that would be our concern. Thank you very much.

Thank you very much. Hawaii Correctional System Oversight Commission providing comments. Jerry, Jeremy Creekmore, Hawaii Association of Professional Nurses in support. Jeremy Creekmore, are you present on zoom?

They're not available. On zoom Chair.

Ellen Awai in support. David Fields in opposition. David Fields, are you present? Come on up.

Chairs, Vice Chairs and members, my name is Dave Fields. I'm a former clinician at Hawaii State Hospital, current law student at UH Manoa. I respect the intent of the bill. Overcrowding is a big issue at Hawaii State Hospital.

I was there most of 2024. But I feel like it's placing a lot of blame on the courts when the issue is actually institutional and administrative at Hawaii State Hospital. And I feel like the bill needs to go further in addressing those things.

There's a bill similar to this in Oregon where they kind of had more oversight over the hospital and the Department of Health and things like that. So I would hope the Bill would address those things as well. I have more details in my written testimony. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Anybody else wishing to testify on SB 955? Okay, come on up, Department of Health.

Marian Tsuji for the Department of Health, Behavioral Health Administration. Sorry, chair for the late testimony, but we do support this, the intent of this bill. We have some recommendations on different parts. But overall we really appreciate the fact that the Legislature is trying to help us with the, our overcrowding.

And trying to get everybody into the right beds. Thank you. We'll be available for questions.

Okay, thank you very much. Anybody else wishing to testify on SB 955? Seeing none. Members, any questions? Okay, Senator Rhoads.

For Judiciary. So some of the one of the criticisms you made or comments you had on this in your testimony was that going from three to two wouldn't maybe not actually end up being three to two because a lot of times there's decisions are split.

Yes.

Is there any constitutional problem or any, any other practical problem that you could see just going to one examiner?

So there was a proposal several years ago when we did the penal code review in 2016 to reduce it to one and both the state and the defense bar objected to that because essentially what was going to end up happening is they're each going to get their own expert to then counter, which will again delay the basically.

But is that, is it simply expert? How does that play out in court? Is that an ex, they're considered expert witnesses and the judge has to decide.

Yes. There's a provision in Chapter 704 now where they each get, they, they're allowed, the defense certainly is allowed to have their own doctor examine the defendant.

So but if you had to and it's a split decision and is, isn't it up to the judge at that point?

Yes, we would have a contested hearing where we would bring everybody in, the doctors would testify, they would be cross examined, the defense, the defendant perhaps would testify and then the judge would make the decision.

But wouldn't that mean then that the state only has to come up with one and then if the, if the defendant wants to get their own, they get their own and we don't have to look for them.

Yes. The state designate would be the, the court's doctor, I would assume under that scenario. And then the defense would hire their own and the state would hire their own if they want. If you were to reduce it to one.

Okay. But then it would be resolved by, by the judge to determine which expert witness to give more credence to.

Yes, and that's, that's kind of how it is now. It's just that we have three right off the bat.

Right. Okay. Okay, thanks. Thanks, Chair.

Okay. Thank you very much. I have questions. Stick around. Okay. You are aware also that this bill does not remove the part that says the court may appoint an additional examiner or examiners. So basically by removing one, we remove the authority from Department of Health in choosing a third, but leaving it up to judicial discretion.

Page 4, lines 9 to 10, 9 to 11. The court in appropriate circumstances may appoint an additional examiner or examiners. So it basically gives the court judicial discretion to appoint more, isn't that right? I'm sorry, that's a leading question. Being cross examined. I'm just.

So we're just removing the authority from departmental pels by passing this bill to judicial discretion, and you'd have no problems with the judges exercising their discretion to.

Appoint three instead of two?

Yes.

Okay. So the, the second doctor would be. So if you look at the provisions of where those doctors. The doctors are appointed.

So still within your list.

Okay, that's the Department of Health's list, however. But so the Department of Health, we, we get. They certify a list, we appoint our two private examiners from that list, and then they give us the third from within their Department. So is the intent to get rid of the third within their Department?

No.

Or. Okay, so we would appoint one from the list and we get one from their Department, and then we could the judiciary could appoint a third examiner.

Because that, that remains on. Or really any other examiners that remains on the statute. We're not removing judicial discretion to appoint examiners. So you have no problem leaving that in the statute then, right? Because I mean you, I would think you would trust your judges to.

Yes. Traditionally. Traditionally that provision has been used to appoint additional examiners from the other, from the other provisions of Chapter 704. We've not necessarily utilized that to appoint them in the three panel. So. And we also do it for when we have to do a neuropsychological examination. That's when we appoint.

It's basically a fourth doctor when they recommended neuropsychological exams.

So I mean in the courts have. So you courts have actually. The next thing is even with. I think the other portion you folks are upset about are the status hearings. But the reality is you folks have status hearings anyway because, I mean, I show up. Excuse me, I did not like since. Sorry about that.

You folks have status hearings anyway, with probation and the like. I mean, so adding two other status hearings shouldn't be an extra burden.

We understand the intent. However, there's already a provision for the Department of Health to be able to file. They can come before us, they can call us, they can email us and say, hey, we want to come before a hearing and say that we don't think this 404 defendant should be here.

In fact, up until 2021, they routinely appeared at every single hearing where we had a motion to transfer a defendant to the custody of the Director of Health pending the exam, pending the 404 exam. They also routinely filed motions to ask us to reconsider our finding of necessity when we transferred people into custody.

That was before we had this huge shortage in, in labor in Department of Health. But same thing with regular criminal cases where the courts require status hearings. I mean, the defendant at any time can petition the court. So by having a status hearing for those in 704, we do not forget the mentally ill defendants.

Instead of prioritizing criminal defendants over those who are mentally ill, which is what the judiciary is doing now with status hearing for criminal defendants, but not those who are mentally ill.

We have routinely fitness. So when a defendant is found unfit to proceed, we have a review hearing every 30-60-90 days, depending on the, the recommendation of the Department of Health doctors. We have routine review hearings.

So then all those people do. Then, then this just adds one more, which is on the 14th day it.

Would add two more because it would. Be the 14th. Well, we don't do that for 404 because they haven't actually been found unfit yet. So the people who are the people that you're talking about in this particular section are the people who have not been found and fit.

They've been found by necessity to have to be transferred to the.

So they're easily forgotten, because they haven't been found unfit. That's the problem. That's the reason why we carry the status hearings. Because they are being forgotten.

We have a hearing. There is a hearing set on a determination of their fitness to proceed. We have a hearing set.

Then you don't mind having an additional to require a four every two week, one week every, just adding two additional review hearings to ensure that they are not being forgotten because people are having a hard time finding examiners.

There is a hearing set already. There is already a hearing set for all of these individual people. The hearings that are being required from this bill are for everybody who's committed on a 404 to have to come back with a doctor's report.

No, it doesn't require doctor's report. It just requires a status hearing.

If we don't have a doctor's report, we wouldn't be able to determine whether or not they still need to be there or not.

Okay, that's judicial discretion then, right? Whether or not to require doctor's report. Whether or not to require those other things, because all those other status hearings I show up on, it doesn't require any of those other reports by the courts. It's all because of judicial discretion. Legislators' concern is that people are being forgotten.

Nobody is being forgotten. All of those. And every single individual who is committed under a 404 has a return hearing set when they are committed. There is not. They're not just sitting in there. They are, they have a return hearing set as soon as they are committed.

So the reports I'm getting from criminal defense attorneys that sometimes because they have difficulty finding examiners for petty misdemeanors or misdemeanors and ending up staying there longer than their sentence, those are just anecdotal and should be ignored.

No, those are not. That's not that we're not finding examiners as the examiners are asking us for extensions of time for those.

That's why we did Act 26 in order to try and stop that, keep the nonviolent petty misdemeanors, people who were ending up sitting not in the hospital, they were actually in OCCC for the most part, but sitting there for 30-60-90 days waiting for their examination to come back.

Instead we did Act 26 in order to get those people immediately into either into the hospital so they could be evaluated for ACT involuntary hospitalization and we could hook them up with AMHD services upon their release. And well, now it's 14 days. So those people are a different subset of the people we're talking about.

The people we're talking about under 404 are when a defendant comes, defense attorney comes in before the court, they move for a three panel examination and they say because of the way the defendant is presenting to me or because I have this information that, that they have a diagnosis a serious mental illness and they're decomping whatever's going on, throwing feces in the, in, in DCR custody or whatnot.

And we therefore believe that it is necessary for this person to be committed to the custody of Director of Health pending the examination. The examination is getting ordered. Most times the examination is already ordered. And the return is there.

I mean, that's the point. The point is because, you know, I'm just arguing with you, and frankly, because I used to be a criminal defense attorney, I do know that status hearings are usually not such as big a deal as you're claiming it to be. So I don't have any further questions.

Okay, moving on. Any other questions for SB 955? Okay. For SB 1613 relating to cannabis. First up, Office of Public Defender and Support. I'm sorry, sorry. SB 1228. I went just wanting to get to cannabis already. Sorry. Relating to Child Welfare Services. First up, Judiciary in support. Next, we have Director Yamane in support. Are you present?

I see. Daisy Hartsfield.

Good morning, Chairs, Vice Chairs and members of the committee. On Behalf of DHS Director Yamani, I'm Daisy Hartsfield, the Social Services Division Administrator. The Department did submit written testimony.

I just wanted to add that we are requesting for an additional member to be added to the work group, and that would be an individual from the department's Child Welfare Services branch.

And the reason for that request to the amendment is so that we can have someone from child welfare at the table at work group discussions so that they can provide the perspective from CWS. I'm available for any other questions. Otherwise, we stand by our testimony. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Office of Wellness and Resiliency in support. Office of Hawaiian affairs in support, National Center for Youth Law, Dana Matsunami in support. Are you present? Okay, Come on up.

Aloha, Chairs, Vice Chairs, committee member. My name is Dana Matsunami. I'm a child welfare lawyer at the National Center for Youth Law. I live here in Hawaii and I work full time with foster youth in our state. The National Center for Youth Law's in strong support of SB 1228.

We all know that youth in Hawaii foster care have terrible at times and sometimes even tragic outcomes. Child welfare cases determine nearly every critical aspect of a young person's life. When they're in state custody, where and with whom they live, where they go to school, whether and how often they see their family, and more.

And right now, within that court process, there's no one who has the responsibility and authority to advocate for what the young person specifically wants.

In listening sessions and community meetings over the past two years, in part through the Mālama 'Ohana Working Group, we have heard youth say, how can you make decisions that change our lives forever without ever hearing from us? Another youth described foster care in Hawaii as a system of luck.

Some are lucky and have an adult in their case who goes above and beyond to listen to and advocate for their needs. Many are not. This bill is a vital step towards ensuring that no young person in Hawaii's future is left to chance. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Next we have Office of Hawaiian Affairs in support. I think I read that. Hawaii Youth Services Network, Judith Clark, please proceed.

Aloha Chairs, members of the committee. I'm Judith Clark, Executive Director of Hawaii Youth Services Network and we support this bill. The Mālama 'Ohana Working Group went through a very extensive process of identifying needs and developing recommendations for improving the child welfare system. This includes reducing delays in legal proceedings and ensuring access to legal representation for youth.

This bill will create the working group that's necessary to develop plans for implementing these important recommendations. Thank you for this opportunity to testify.

Thank you very much. Next we have Hawaii Children's Action Network Speaks in support. Marilyn Yamamoto, Hawaii Coalition for Child Protective Reform in support. EPIC Ohana Hopes Initiative in support. Shana Kukila, Hawaii Coalition for Child Protective Reform in support. Melissa Mayo, are you present on Zoom? In support.

She's not present on Zoom, Chair.

Dara Carlin providing comments. Keola Pagud in support. Karen Worthington in support. Ellen Awai in support. : Laurie Tochiki in support. Anybody else wishing testifying SB 1228. Seeing none, members any questions? Daisy Hartsfield and I guess also Dana Matsunami for National Center for Youth Law. My big question is we passed a similar bill earlier regarding working group.

The earlier bill puts the working group under Office of Wellness and Resilience and this one puts it under the Judiciary, which is preferable. Let's go with Matsunami.

I think it's a slightly different working group that you're referring to. There's the one that I think you're referring to is a larger mission more around like general child welfare outcomes. This working group is specific to youth's right to legal counsel in the case. So it's is housed within the Judiciary.

Yeah. And I would have responded similarly.

Okay.

Okay. So it doesn't matter if we pass both them.

Correct. Because they are, they will address different issues.

Okay. It's just that the people in both may end up having to work. Okay. More jobs.

Correct, you might have the same people into different work groups.

Thank you very much.

Thank you.

Any other questions? Yeah, no, I don't have quorum. I need one more person. Can someone call?

We're going to recess for quorum.

Following the 9:30 calendar for the joint session of Health Human Services and Judiciary. Same protocol procedures apply from the 9 o'clock calendar. We are going to limit this to one minute. We have a huge amount of testimony. For those on Zoom audio will be muted, video disabled until shortly before its your turn to testify.

Audio will be muted, video disabled shortly before it's your turn to testify. Technical glitch in your time to testify. We're going to have to move on to the next person due to time constraints. So first up, we have Office of the Public Defender in support. Next, Attorney General providing comments. Department of Human Services providing comments.

Department of Taxation providing comments. Okay, come on up.

Chair, Vice Chair, Members of the committees. According to Piper, Department of Taxation. The only thing I have to add to our comments are the revenue estimates that did come in. These are all in millions of dollars for tax year 2026. 2.8 gain, 27 would be a 2.9 gain. 28 would be a 3.0 gain.

29 would be a 3.1 gain. 30 would be a 3.2 gain. And 31 would be a 3.2 gain. I would note there's a low level of confidence in these numbers given that we're making estimates on currently clandestine operations. Thank you.

Thank you very much. And I see. Steve, I'm here in opposition. Come on up. You have one minute.

Morning, chairs, vice chairs, Members of the Committee. We stand in strong opposition to Senate Bill 1613. As public officials, I think our first job is to do no harm and this bill would do harm.

What kind of message would be sending to our kids that a now powerful drug is legalized and the stamp of approval is placed on it. We're telling them that Marijuana is safe and it's not for many people. We have many more near daily users.

And the problem with that, with the increased potency is we have increases for teens, we have increases for adults. And it follows the Pareto principle that a smaller percentage is going to consume most of it. So research is 40% of the users are daily users. That means when they go to school or working, that's daily users.

They account for 80% of the Marijuana that is sold in this country. So 80% of your tax dollars at these stores is going to be for them. So I don't think we want to be in the addiction for profit business. I hope you folks don't. Thank you.

Thank you very much. At this time we're going to recess this and continue on with the decision making for 9 o'clock calendar. And after that we will continue on with that testimony. Thank you very much.

Calling recalling the 9 o'clock calendar for decision making. We have quorum now, so first up for HHS Sheriff's recommendation is to pass this with technical amendments or going to De date this to December 312050 noting the late testimony Department of F. We're also going to blank out the appropriation and add it. Add in tech amendments as necessary for clarity and consistency.

Any comments, questions or concerns? Passed with amendments. Seeing none. Vice Chair for the vote. SB709 yes.

Senate Bill 709. Recommendation of the chairs to pass with amendments. Chair and Vice Chair vote aye. Senator Hashimoto is excused. Senator Keokolole is excused. Senator Favela.

Aye.

Recommendation is adopted, sir.

Same recommendation for JDC. Any questions or concerns? Not Senator Gabbard.

On SB709, the recommendations to pass with amendments. Chair Rhodes. Aye. Vice Chairwood size. Senator Chang. Aye. Senator San Benimatura. Aye. Senator Oah. Aye.

Measure passes for SB955. Chair's recommendation is to pass this with amendments. We are just. We're gonna reduce the number of qualified examiners from three down to one. And we. Any technical and grammatical changes necessary to account for the singular examiner. Any comments, questions or concerns? Seeing none. Vice Chair for the vote.

Yes. Senate Bill 955. Recommendation of the chairs to pass with amendments. Three Members are present. Any reservations? Any nos? Senator Hashimoto. Thank you. Recommendation is adopted.

Chair on SB 955. JDC. The recommendation from JDC is the same. Any questions or concerns, see now Senator Gabbard.

SB 955. All Members present. Are there any. No Votes or reservations? No. 1. No vote for Senator Wab. And as it passes.

Hey. For SB 1228, Chair's recommendation is to pass this with amendments. We are going to add to the working group a Member of the message of the Domestic Violence center and Tech Amendments community. Domestic violence community. Excuse me. A Member of. Well, you know, the Domestic Violence Action Center. We want to make sure it's specific. Okay.

Just to ensure, we're gonna add in a Member of the Domestic Violence Action center to the working group and pass with technical amendments. We're going to blank out the appropriation date, add in the defect date of December 312050. Conversation needs to continue. Any comments, questions or concerns? Passed with amendments.

Vice Chair for the vote SB 1228 with amendments.

Four Members are present. Any reservations? Any nos? Recommendation is adopted.

Chair for JC Member. Same recommendation. Any questions or concerns? If not Senator Gabbard Members present any.

No votes or reservations Hearing none. The measure passes.

Okay.

And with that we are adjourned on the 9:00 panel recalling the 9:30 calendar on SB 1613.

Next up. Sorry. Thank you. We have Hawaii Department of Agriculture providing comments. Next we have Health Resources Administration providing comments. I see Office of the Public Defender finally showing up. Come on up. You have one minute.

Good morning, Chair. Vice Chair Sonny Gannon, Deputy Public Defender. Support this bill with an amendment. We'd like to read it into the record. We believe that HRS291E61 which discusses operating a vehicle under the influence of any drug still controls. We suggest the deletion of Part 4, Section 5 through Section 9.

We believe that this complicates the law and will lead to further dismissals. Thank you.

Okay, thank you very much. Next up we have Department of Budget and Finance providing comments. Honolulu Police Department. Raymond Ikehara in opposition. Oh, not on zoom. President.

Morning chairs, Vice Chairs, Committee Members. My name is Ernest Robello. I'm a lieutenant with the Narcotics Vice Division of the Honolulu Police Department. I'm here on behalf of my Major Reina Ikehara, here to testify that the Honolulu Police Department opposes this bill. We have submitted written testimony and we stand on that testimony.

I will be available for any comments or questions, if there are any. I thank you for this opportunity.

Thank you very much. And I see also Andrew Goff showing up for Attorney General providing comments. Come on up.

Morning chairs, Vice chairs and Members. Andrew Goff, Deputy Attorney General. You do have our written comments and a few suggested amendments and I'll be available for questions.

Okay, thank you very much. Next we have HSAC in opposition. Alan Johnson, come on up.

Aloha chairs, Vice Chair, distinguished Members. I'm Alan Johnson, Chair of the Hawaii Substance Abuse Coalition. HHAC opposes this bill for legalization of teleprevention program can be implemented first. And here's why. There's General agreement that cannabis use is not healthy for young people. Less harm adults, more harm kids.

Their brains are still developing and suffer from a loss of IQ, impairments in reasoning, judgment, emotional balance. And these impairments can last for decades, affecting just when they need those brain functions the most for jobs, having relationships and family. Some kids are getting scary with schizophrenia. And there is a growing trend.

The evidence is clear that youth perceive cannabis to be safe. That's a major health concern. Once they are adults with fully developed brains, they can make their own decisions. But as kids with developing brains, we say this is serious. So let's pre warn our youth and inform parents before legalization, which some states have recommended.

And we want to Have a running start, not a hope to catch up. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Next we have Jaclyn Moore, Big Island going dispensaries in support. Are you for. Okay, Jaclyn, come on up. You have one minute.

Thank you so much. I just want to say first and foremost, thank you for keeping this discussion alive. It needs to be addressed. Big Island Grown stands in strong support of SB 1613. More specifically, creating a regulatory framework that addresses the entirety of the plant.

When I'm listening to the testimony right now, I need everyone to really understand the reality which is recreational is already here. Okay? There is complete confusion in the marketplace. I'm not even talking about local, traditional, unregulated market. I'm talking about product coming over from the mainland completely riddled with pesticides and solvents.

There needs to be some basic consumer protections in place, regardless of what philosophically we believe about adult use or legalization efforts or not. It's happening now. And the Legislature, I hope, will pass something to acknowledge the fact that these pop up illicit dispensaries are marketing to residents and tourists alike. They're not age gating for kids.

There's absolutely no care or awareness for that. So doing something inactivity is actually, actually creating the very thing that people are afraid of.

Thank you very much. Jacqueline Tai Cheng, Hawaii Cannabis Industry Association. Tai, are you present? Okay, moving on. Jenny Fouch, Hawaii HIDTA, in opposition. Come on up.

Good morning, chairs, Vice chairs and Committee. I'm Jenny Fouch from the Hawaii High Intensity Drug Trafficking Area. This is Gary Yebuda, he's the Director. I want to express our concerns regarding the issues associated with community health and safety if SB 1613 is passed. Please vote no.

Cannabis use is a public health concern that will have lasting impacts on our youth and on our environment. This is not the source of revenue that our state needs in order to improve the welfare of its citizens.

There's so much discussion around the income that this will generate for our state, but there's rarely a conversation about what the additional cost is to our health, law enforcement and education systems. We must prioritize the health system, safety and well being of our citizens.

I urge the Committee to consider the long term consequences that could arise from allowing the use of recreational marijuana and reject this proposal. Thank you.

Okay, thank you very much. Can I, can I just say something really quick on behalf of the HIDTA. Okay, go on. I'm sorry, I just want to explain what the High Intensity Drug Trafficking Area is. It's under the Executive office of the President, Office of National Drug control. Policy.

In 1990, the Hawaii Haida became a high intensity drug trafficker.

I'm sorry, you did not register. We need to go register. I'll do it. Yeah, I'll sign up right now. Okay. I think this is important. A lot of people who have registered, we need to go through their names and then you can come and testify. What do I sign, ma'am? I don't know.

So next up, Hawaii Christian Coalition and opposition. Margaret Mejia, are you present? Margaret? Okay, next. Nicholas Levins Drug Policy Forum of Hawaiian Support.

Aloha chair, Vice Chair Members, Nicholas Levins with the Drug Policy Forum, Hawaii in strong support of this bill. You know, it's really high time that and pun intended that Hawaii recalibrate its policy on cannabis and move toward adult use legalization.

When we compare the relative harms of cannabis compared to, say, alcohol, which kills 170,000 people a year and yet it is illicit substance. I would also note that the continued criminalization of children is not in their interest or nor is it in their family's interest.

And the arrest data shows that criminalization of cannabis reaches hundreds of juveniles and their families per year. So to my friends on the sectarian side of the aisle, I asked them to take a look at the war on cannabis. Look, take a look at the drug war and to seek justice and to defend the oppressed. Mahalo.

Thank you very much. Next. I see Michael Golojuch with pride at work on Zoom and support. Please proceed. One minute.

Yes. Aloha. Michael Golojuch Jr. President of Private Work Pronouns. He, him. We stand in strong support of this bill. It is time to actually legalize adult use recreational use of cannabis. All the problems that they.

Everybody's saying that this will bring are already on our shores and we are not addressing them because we do not have the resources to do so. And some are just turning a blind eye. This is a social justice issue. There is no scientific data that Marijuana is a gateway drug.

What is a gateway to those higher, those illicit substances is poverty, discrimination, hatred, and bigotry as well as. So we encourage you that they should be fighting those things if we want to end our problem with the war on drugs, end the war on drugs and deal with those situations. So we encourage you to pass this bill.

We thank you for hearing it. Thank you for having the. The strength to do this, and we encourage you to pass this bill. Mahalo.

Thank you very much. Tina Yamaki, Retail merchants of Hawaii in opposition. Are you present, Tina?

I'm available on Zoom.

Okay, next. Tom Yamachika, Tax foundation of Hawaii providing comments on Zoom. Tom, are you present?

Aloha. This is Jane Mcmillan. On behalf of Tommy Amachita for the Tax foundation of Hawaii, we have submitted some comments on the measure. Our comments are directed towards the new tax. We generally do not agree with the Proposition of a new tax that can be classified as a city tax. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Judaih McRoberts, Kauai Hemp Company in opposition. Are you present on. Sorry, no, they're not present on zoom. Okay, not present on zoom. Casey Rothstein, Green Aloha Limited in support. Please proceed. Casey, you have one minute.

Thank you very much for the opportunity to give testimony today. My name is Casey Rothstein. I'm the CEO of Green Aloha. We are the Kauai Medical Cannabis License. As my colleague Jaclyn Moore said, recreational cannabis is already here. It is in stores all over Hawaii.

The farm bill has allowed hemp to be sold and hemp is the same as cannabis and processed hemp makes the same intoxicating products as cannabis does. So this bill will actually regulate the industry and it's Legislature's job to regulate things. For the matter of public health and public safety.

To do nothing, to not address this doesn't keep recreational cannabis from happening. It doesn't protect the keiki. It just does exactly that. It does nothing. So I urge you to pass this bill and encourage your colleagues in the House not to do nothing.

Thank you very much, Casey. Next I see Rick Collins, Hawaii Public Health Institute, providing comments. Please proceed. Rick, you have one minute. Okay. I guess nobody. Is Rick Collins there? I thought that was him. Karen O'Keefe, Hawaii Marijuana Policy Project, in support. Karen O'Keefe, please proceed. You have one minute.

Apologies. I'm Karen O'Keefe, Director of State Policies at the Marijuana Policy project. We support SB 1613 and HACR's suggested amendments. Cannabis prohibition has not worked. 19% of adults in Hawaii admit using cannabis in the past year due to prohibitions.

Consumers either buy illicit cannabis that can be contaminated or laced or they buy hemp synthesized intoxicants which are readily available in the state to both children and adults. Regulated cannabis is far safer than unregulated and gas station cannabis.

We now have more than a decade of government survey data that shows that teens cannabis use has mostly decreased in legalization states. Post legalizations, adults should be free to make their own decisions about cannabis and they deserve a safe regulated product.

Many cannabis consumers, including my husband, use it as a pain reliever or for sleep and it improves their well being in many cases. Please support the bill for freedom, justice and safety. Mahalo.

Yes, they're here on Zoom. Chair.

Okay, thank you very much. Next, Carolyn Lalusa, Loah, botanicals and support on Zoom. Carolyn, are you present?

Yeah, one minute. Carolyn, turn on your audio and turn on your video.

I am not sure whether video is not on. My camera's on. Okay, but I'll get started. Aloha, Chairs. Senators, Legalization is the regulation that we lack. Today, there's an epidemic of illegal operators with unlicensed retail cannabis dispensaries selling cannabis labeled as hemp on Oahu. Last year there were 10 illegal operators. This year there are over 40.

You can find cannabis at the airport, near schools, in Mini Mars, and it's available for online sales and home delivery. The lack of regulation and enforcement coordination continues to endanger the public as many of these products are contaminated and available to anyone, including our keiki.

We need comprehensive legislation that includes the framework to assign a single authority to manage the complexities of this plant at all stages of life. So hemp, cannabis and finished product. I think we can all agree that this is a public health and public safety issue and inaction is unacceptable. Thank you for your time.

Thank you very much. I see Tai Cheng here. Hawaii Cannabis Industry Association. Are you going to provide testimony or stand on it? You have one minute.

Thank you. Chair, Vice Chair, Members of the Committee. My name is Tai Cheng. I'm chair of the Hawaii Cannabis Association. We're in support of this bill. Hawaii is now the last democratically controlled state not to legalize cannabis. 24 other states have done so, including three Republican controlled states.

Many of the arguments we hear today were the same arguments were brought back then. No state has decided to reverse its legalization of cannabis in 2027. Marijuana Business Daily believes that Made in America Cannabis will total $53.5 billion. The Hawaii medical market is only 1% of that large number.

Currently, the Biden Administration has started rescheduling, and the DOJ and HHS have both agreed to reschedule cannabis to Schedule three. The new federal Administration has also shown that it's willing to reschedule. Trump voted yes on Florida's legalization bill. His newly confirmed HHS secretary says he believes in legalization of cannabis. And Elon Musk has smoked cannabis.

Okay, next up, United Public Workers in opposition, Democratic Party Hawaii and support Larry Smith, Kupuna Caucus of Democratic Party Hawaii and support Brian Baker Hinamalka in opposition, Hawaii Family Forum in opposition, Law Enforcement Action Partnership in support, Democratic Party for Hawaii Education Caucus and support Hawaii Smart approaches to Marijuana. In opposition. The Coalition for Drug Free Hawaii.

In opposition. Luana Peterson, reimagining public safety and support Hawaii Afternoon alliance providing comments. Eamon L. Swahiti, are you present in opposition? Amen. Okay, moving on. Scott Kobayashi, in opposition. Scott.

He's present on Zoom chair.

Oh, on Zoom. He was supposed to be in person. Okay, please proceed. Scott. Scott, turn on your audio and turn on your mic.

Hi, can you hear me?

Yes, go on. You have one minute.

Yeah, I'm just voicing my opposition. I am a pastor and I've been serving in Youth Ministry for 18 years and I just want to voice my opposition. I've just seen so many youth of mine that have been on drugs and just lose their hope in school and their future and their careers.

But I also hear great stories of them getting off drugs and getting their life back together. So I just want to testify as a youth pastor and as a father that I am opposed to this bill. Thank you.

Okay, thank you very much. Next we have Landis Lum in opposition. Landis, are you present? Come on up.

Aloha chairs and Members. I'm a family and addiction medicine doc, Landis Love.

Thank you.

I'm a addiction and family medicine document. Driving stoned is driving drunk. My patient had a head on collision killing a tourist. Her daughter in the ICU for four months. Still in pain. Years later, 27% drive stoned on a daily basis. Since legalized in Colorado, cannabis Traffic deaths increased 138% by age 45. Users have brain damage on MRI.

Older facial age, less happiness, more are on welfare. For every dollar in legalization tax revenue, states would incur $4 in costs. Legalization increases teen cannabis use. For Elton John it's addictive and leads to other drugs. Legalizing marijuana in Canada and America is one of the greatest mistakes of all time. Only 10% use it only for health reasons.

Most use it for fun. Do we want to leave our Keiki a legacy of much?

Dr. Love? Next we have Joy Chinin, also in opposition. Joy, you're present.

Foreign.

My name is Joy Chennan, and I'm a mother and grand grandmother. And I appreciated Dr. Lum's testimony right now that he gave these statistics. And, you know, when I look at this Bill, I'm opposed to this SB 1613, because if the main reason for legalizing Marijuana is for government income, that is not a good reason.

The consequences are too great. The consequences outweigh that benefit. And you and I are here to do what is good for Keiki and our families. They are our future. Please, we don't. I don't want this drug in our Hawaii. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Next, we have Emily Sarasa in support. Emily, are you present?

Morning, Senators. Thank you for letting me testify. My name is Emily Serrasa. I'm testifying in my individual capacity. I'm hearing a lot of concerns today about the youth. And as someone who was young not so long ago, I feel like I want to raise the issue. That's.

Well, the point that's already been raised that the youth are already consuming this product. They're getting it from the black market. They're getting it from gas stations and smoke shops. It's already happening.

So when people say here in this room that they want to legalize, they're saying they want to preserve the status quo and continue this harm to our communities. If we want kids to stop using cannabis, we need better education. I got a DARE education. It sucked. It did not stop me. It does not stop my friends.

And I think that is more harmful. So I urge you to pass this Bill out of Committee. Make amendments if you need to delay the start date, if you need to allocate additional resources to the DoH so it can actually ramp up the education because they do not have enough right now.

Let it pass out of this Committee. Let it go through the legislative process. More than half of our residents support this, so I hope that you will, too. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Next, we have Daniel Chinnan in opposition. Daniel? zero, in person. Okay.

Morning, chairs, vice chairs, and Members of the Committee. Thank you so much for this time. I want to honor your time with the 50 seconds I have left, so I'll just go straight to it. I'm a father, husband, and pastor, a Member of the community, and I stand in strong opposition to this measure.

As the person before me shared that Marijuana is already in our streets, and it's true. So we shouldn't be opening up more opportunity. We should be decreasing that opportunity. Just to give you guys an idea how easily accessible it is, my son's in high school, he gets offered a joint for five bucks if he wants it.

He gets offered edibles just in the classroom. So it's there, it's out there in our schools. The medical Marijuana Card has been abused as well. I have a family friend who's in his mid-20s. He just got diagnosed with schizophrenia this past year of using medical Marijuana. So thank you so much for your time.

Okay, thank you very much. Next, we have Brett Colbus in opposition. Are you present, Brett? Please.

Yes, Madam Chair. Mahalo, man Chair, San Buen venture care road Committee Members. My name is Brett colbus. I'm a 26 year Navy veteran, a retired civil servant. During my civil servant career, I was the alcohol drug control officer for the U. S. Pacific fleet submarine force here in Hawaii.

During that time, I had the opportunity to attend many NA and AA meetings. I talked to hundreds of addicts during those meetings and 90% of them indicated that they started got on the road to their drug addiction through smoking Marijuana.

So the misnomer that it's not a gateway drug, I disagree with, and I would say 50% of those said that they started when they were in high school or before. So I strongly oppose this Bill. Mahalo.

Thank you very much. Next we have Jermaine Myers in opposition. Jermaine, are you present on zoom? They're not present on zoom. Chair Ron Yoshida in opposition. Is that Ron on zoom? Aloha chairs.

Aloha chairs and Members of the Joint Committee. My name is Ron Yoshida and I stand in heartfelt opposition to Senate Bill 1613. As was so clearly explained in the movie lilo and stitch, Hawaii is about Ohana, and Ohana means that no one is left behind.

I believe that if we pass this Bill, our Ohana will be negatively impacted and many will be left behind. As a former state certified substance abuse counselor, I have witnessed firsthand the negative effects that Marijuana use has had on families.

And with the potency of Marijuana today being so much higher than before, today's users don't just experience a buzz, but consistent use can cause mental, serious mental and psychological damage that can last a lifetime. A vote in opposition to this Bill is a vote in favor of our families.

I encourage you strongly, please vote in favor of our families, our Ohana, so that no one is left behind. Mahalo.

Thank you very much. Next we have Robert Benz in opposition. Is that you, Robert?

Robert Benz, certified organic, USDA certified hemp farmer and a Member of the hemp task force. The m task force and the farmers were very clear in the Opposition of including adult use, which is federally illegal, with what is federally legal hemp as addition to that. This Bill, it's not about legalization.

It's about furthering the oligarchy of just eight dispensaries. Massachusetts, which this Bill is still basically copying, has been plagued with corruption. There's so many news articles about the corruption. The cash cow has dried up. The green rush is over. The amount of money that they think that they could make is not at all reasonable.

You can't over regulate, over tax and think that this is going to be able to attract anyone out of the legacy.

Thank you very much, Robert.

Also need have 2121 year old. I'm sorry, Robert.

It's other people's time right now. Thank you.

It's a bad Bill.

Drew Daniels next in support.

Drew, please proceed. Aloha chairs and Committee Members. My name is Drew Daniels. I am a cannabis industry professional. I've traveled all over the continent and met people from Hawaii that have moved away and they can't wait for the opportunity to come home.

I see this Bill as an opportunity to set up the framework for an industry that has a very bright future. As someone else mentioned, no states have gone back. This isn't going backwards, it's going forwards.

When we see federal legalization, I really hope that Hawaii is in a place to build up their farmers and local workforce because I see this as an opportunity to do something right and to keep the workforce home as well as maybe even bring some back.

I stand on my written testimony that kind of, kind of rebutes the, the misnomers and the, the reefer madness style kind of anecdotes.

Thank you very much, Mr. Daniels. Next we have Dr. Rothstein in support. Are you present, Mark Rothstein on Zoom?

They're present on Zoom. Chair.

Please proceed. Dr. Rothstein, can you hear me? Yes. Please proceed. You have 53 minutes. Seconds. Seconds.

Sure. Sorry. Aloha. I'm Mark Rothstein, a licensed physician in Hawaii and Ohio. I have worked as a family physician for over four decades. I strongly.

Can you turn on your video? Okay. Please proceed. Keep going.

I strongly support SB 1613. I first saw opiate abuse disorder and PTSD firsthand in rural Appalachia. Many of my patients self medicated with Marijuana to alleviate their symptoms. Let me address some misconceptions and anecdotal testimony that I've heard previously today.

Yes, there's a cannabis use disorder similar to alcohol and tobacco, but studies have shown that legalizing adult cannabis thing, we have so many testifiers, so we're going to need to cut you off.

We're down to one minute. Next, we have Jason Hanley in opposition. Jason, are you present on Zoom?

They're not present on Zoom. Chair.

Hey. Lynn Latz Rothstein in support. Lynn, I, I thought I saw you back there. Are you present on Zoom?

They're also not a present on Zoom.

Okay, Michaela Kobayashi, I'm here. Okay. Please turn on your audio and please turn on your video.

Okay. I don't know. Ah, there we go. I support the legislation. I would like to walk into a license shop where the product has been tested. I'm a 75 year old businesswoman. Can you say your full name? Sorry. Lynn Last Rothstein. Thank you. I'm 75 years old, a former public school teacher and a businesswoman.

I have used cannabis for many years. I've never progressed to anything stronger. I use it the way someone would a glass of wine. I don't drink because alcohol is linked to several different kinds of cancers. Many cancers in the U.S. according to the World Health Organization, are, are directly caused by alcohol consumption.

I abstain from cannabis when I travel and I have no problem with that. I believe that all these smoke shops all over the island are a danger to everybody. Anyone can walk in there and buy whatever they have with no testing, no regulation. It can be contaminated, it can be adulterated.

Adult use would have everything tested to make sure that it is safe for use, but over 21 years old.

Thank you very much, Ms. Vastin. Okay, moving on. Michaela Kobayachi, in opposition. Are you present, Michaela?

Yes.

Okay, please proceed. You have also one minute.

Okay. Mahalo for your hard work. I know this is not an easy job, so I appreciate everything that you all do. I'm Michela Kobayashi and I strongly oppose this Bill. I'm a native Hawaiian. I'm a mom. I've worked with teenagers for over 10 years as a teacher and as a youth pastor.

And in the past we've heard many testimonies from a wide variety of community leaders and Members such as police, healthcare workers, cancer society, DOE educators, principals, counselors, pastors, parents and grandparents. And we are all afraid of the negative effects that the consequences of this Bill will have.

We are the ones who will be dealing with the people and picking up the pieces. And simply put, we're just afraid that the negative consequences will outweigh the positives. I'm a product of parents, parents who are adults and used Marijuana. And I was removed from my home. And so I strongly oppose this Bill. Please vote no.

Thank you so much for your time.

Okay, thank you very much. Next we have Josiah in support. Josiah, are you present on Zoom?

He's not present on Zoom.

Chair Andre Wootton in support. Andre, are you present on Zoom?

They're also not present on Zoom.

Okay, we have 86 individuals registering in opposition. Also 86 individuals registering in support and no one else having registered to testify. Anybody else wishing testify on SB 1613? Okay, let's go with this person in front. First, state your full name and one minute.

Hello, my name is Anthony Alanjen. I'm with the United States of Ganja. And as one of the previous testifiers mentioned, cannabis is already being sold by children to children in the school. And so continuation of the status quo just means that situation is going to continue.

It's a question of if we're going to do more of the same or are we going to try something different approach to get different results. Legalizing cannabis market is the only hope for ending the black market. A vote against this Bill is the vote to continue the failed prohibition system and the black market that thrives under it.

As long as a black market exists, children will have access. Central regulation of an underground market is impossible. We have to stop criminalizing cannabis and end the war against it. This Bill is. I hope everyone understands that criminalizing something doesn't affect its availability. It simply reclassifies the providers as criminals.

I knew someone that was in prison when they criminalized tobacco, and there wasn't a day that they could not get cigarettes. It just went from being legal to being a crime. And you can't keep drugs out of a maximum security prison. So what chance do we have of keeping.

Thank you.

Thank you very much.

There's somebody on Zoom who may have registered and I went over. Could you identify yourself? Is this is 1613? You have one minute.

Can you hear me?

Yes, Please proceed.

Aloha, Senators. My name is Jedi McRoberts and I am the President of Kauai Hemp Company, Hawaii's largest certified organic hemp farm and CBD producer. I appreciate the opportunity to submit testimony and respectfully urge amendments to address serious concerns regarding proposed regulations on hemp.

The proposed 30 milligram THC limit for tinctures, far more restrictive than the Federal Farm Bill. 0.3% THC standard, effectively eliminating most full spectrum tinctures and severely damaging local businesses. The regulation would cripple Hawaii's hemp industry, making it impossible for businesses like mine to compete and survive. I strongly urge the Committee to align with the farm bills.

0.3% THC standards to maintain product integrity and House and industry viability. The House version of this Bill did make amendments to reflect these requests and changes that I've just provided. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Okay, you're next. We're going to go by row, so come on up. You have identify yourself. You have one minute.

Hello, Committee. I'm Cal Channan and I'm strongly opposed to this. It's already been shared that there's a number of people waiting to come back to Hawaii to grow Marijuana. If we see already illegal shops popping up right now, can we imagine how much more is going to be sold when we legalize this?

Can we imagine how much more of our youth are going to be exposed to this? The biggest problem among our young people here is keeping our best and brightest here in Hawaii. How many of our youth are going to be damaged? How much of their motivation will be killed as they are exposed to this?

I urge you on behalf of our young people and the future of Hawaii, you guys are representatives of the best and brightest. Let's do this for the next generation as well. Let's keep Marijuana out.

Thank you very much. Okay, anybody else on the first I see Lambert. Captain Lambert, come on up. Identify.

Good afternoon, chairs, vice chairs, Members of the community. Mike Lambert speaking on behalf of dle. So I know we submitted written testimony, but I wanted to provide you guys with additional information for decision making regarding what was discussed. So for example, in New Mexico, in regards to regulation, to making sure that it's Safe, they distributed 3,000 licenses.

Is only a thousand license locations are able. Able to be checked at a cost of 6.54 million.

I'm sorry, do. Captain Lambert, are you in opposition? Comment?

Sorry, I'm in. I'm in opposition and I want to provide information for decision making.

Thank you.

Okay, sorry. So. And Your income was 21.8 million at a regulation budget of 6.54, meaning that at a third of the income, only a third of the regulation locations are regulated. In regards to arrest data, in Honolulu, 22,000 people are arrested for all crimes and only 46 of them were for Marijuana.

And just to let everyone know, a lot of times Marijuana is a secondary arrest for like a warrant or something else. Finally, for this Committee's consideration is that when it goes from Schedule 1 to Schedule 3, that will impact the medical market. So what will happen is if we get ahead of ourselves. Okay.

And Captain Lambert, we do not have your written testimony, so please submit that later.

I apologize. I'm not with the I'm not the Director nominee for.

Yeah, I understand that. We don't have.

You didn't receive it. I apologize.

Thank you. Okay, anybody else on the first row? And then we're going to go to the second row. Second row who haven't testified yet. Come on up. You have one minute.

Thank you. Gary Abuta. I'm the Executive Director for the High Intensity Drug Trafficking Area Federal Fund out of the Executive office of the President. I just wanted to say that we became a high intensity drug trafficking area in 1990 because of our methamphetamine problem. That's how you qualify. Ominously, how you qualify.

I have 47 years of law enforcement experience. I was the chief of police for the Maui Police Department. With these eyes, I have seen the degradation of our culture, of our island. I have friends, police friends that can't walk like us because they fell from a helicopter or they came down on a helicopter.

Trying to remove the invasive species known as Marijuana from our indigenous forests will destroy our environment and our culture and our children's way of life. I see this with these 47 years of experience. Now I'm in prevention and treatment in my organization because I realize law enforcement alone cannot solve. Thank you very much. Thank you.

Okay, anybody else on second row who hasn't testified? Now I'll go to the third row. Anybody on the third row who has not testified? Come on up, Director. For yourself or for your Director?

Yes. Brenna Hashimoto, Director of the Department of Human Resources Development. We did submit writt testimony. Hopefully you received it. If not, I will make sure that you get it. We have concerns about three provisions that are in the current Bill and how they address the workplace, the state workplace.

We want to make sure that not only the manufacturer, distribution, disposition and possession of Marijuana in the workplace would not be tolerated. And there are three places in this Bill that we think need to be addressed to protect our workplaces from the use of cannabis.

Thank you. And like I have directed to Director of Law Enforcement, you need to submit your written testimony.

I think it was, but if we don't. If it wasn't, we'll resubmit it. Thank.

Okay, thank you very much. Okay, anybody else? Second row. Okay. ACLU. Come on up.

Aloha, Senators. Carrie an. ACLU, Hawaii. We strongly support this measure. No amount of enforcement will stop cannabis. It's already here. It has been here since time immemorial. It was not. Stop it. Second, we need to ignore the realities. There are still kids that are being arrested and adults that money into prevention into youth programs.

If we're so concerned about the harms, we will put it into what the needs are for our community. And we want to point out that this is an issue of freedom. Just as any of you can go and pick up a cocktail or or caffeine or a cookie with sugar, which many health experts say it's dangerous.

People should be able to use cannabis. Let adults be adults and make decisions for themselves. Years ago, law enforcement were in these halls opposing fiercely medical cannabis, claiming that there would be drug cartels throughout our community. That has never happened. And today they're here saying, we support medical cannabis.

Let's look at data, let's make informed decisions, let's consider risk, let's mitigate it, let's have social justice and let's recognize that are being arrested. If we care about them, we'll stop prohibition.

Carry on. Okay, next up, ACLU identify yourself and hello.

Chair, vice chairs, Members of the Committee, Alan Cardenas Jr. I'm in strong opposition with this. I grew up in Nanakuli homestead. I remember a time plenty aloha neighbors take care of neighbors and malama each other and so forth. Fast forward today. Gary Ubuda, hit it. It's a degradation of the minds of our children, families and communities.

Look at the news reports from the last two years. Homicides up 80%. Domestic violence, but not. What's not being reported is the suicides amongst our people. From Makaha to Kapolei to Ewa to Waipahu. Our kids are in trouble. They need help. Our kids need hope, not dope. And that's why I ask that we oppose this.

Thank you so much. Malo.

Okay, thank you very much. Okay, anybody else on the second row? Okay, third row. Anybody who hasn't testified, come on up on the third row. I see. Raising your hand. I'm sorry, that's the fourth row. Well, we'll start in the fourth row then. Come on up. It's okay, Just identify yourself and you know me? I. One Minute.

Aloha, Chair, Senators, my name is Kimmer Horson. I am in strong opposition to this Bill. According to Samuel Dr. Wilkinson from the Yale School of Medicine, Marijuana is one second makes it susceptible to lung cancer, schizophrenia. It has three times tar inhalation in cigarettes. It's four times the carbon monoxide inhalation. It. It causes cognitive impairment.

So it'll be increase in DUIs and risk for short and long term psychosis, other psychotic disorders such as anxiety, restlessness, insomnia, depression and changes in appetite. We are not California. We Are not any other state. We are the Hawaiian Kingdom. Marijuana I've seen as a barrier to employment.

I saw a United States Coast Guard man growing plants in his back in his home on school field and he got arrested. It destroyed his career. It's not allowed on the federal level. Why it should be allowed on the state level. It's a barrier to employment.

And we are not Snoop Dogg, Nicki Minaj, we are not Brittney Griner who was imprisoned, as we all know, for a very long time in Russia.

Yes, thank you very much. Okay, hold on, I just want to make sure. Third row. Are we done with the third row? No, you're the last row. So fourth row. Anybody on the fourth row? Okay, who hasn't spoken yet? Come on up. I think we're down to the last row now.

No, second to last one, but come on up. Can't count. Three45. Okay, go ahead.

White power graduate. I'm a tire farmer, fish farm worker. Connected the first Hawaiian village in 2017. President Donald Trump made it a national monument. I come from a legacy of 235 years from the Hawaiian Kingdom and I'm in strong support of SB 1613. When you vote no. First off, the Senators who supported me last year, thank you.

This is meaning for those who oppose or still guessing, a vote no. Let me be clear. Voting against SB 1613 is a vote to uphold system of systemic inequities, forfeit minions in revenue and ignore the will of always people.

Voting no means Hawaii loses millions to other states while our schools, roads, hospitals, even the state capital remain deteriorating. Voting no means upholding systemic racism and denying second chances to those harmed by outdated laws.

Thank you very much. Thank you. Okay, okay, fourth row. Anybody in fourth row? Fifth row. Okay, wait a second. There's somebody here in the fifth row. Come on out. Okay. Identify yourself and support our opposition or comments.

Aloha. My name is Kim Cordery and I'm speaking on behalf of aloha freedom coalition, 20,000 followers. And also on behalf of my husband. I did submit a testimony.

I oppose SB 1613 and I just want to speak a little bit about my husband's experience prior to finding God, which he says is is a gateway drug that led him to many other drugs. He says that Marijuana is mind numbing and leads to a non motivated state. Is this what we want for our people of Hawaii?

It's not what I want. I don't. And I, I have never taken drugs and I was lucky to have not experienced any of these things. But this is a Grave concern for our community. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Okay, next up, come on up. Identify yourself.

Hello, I'm Stephen Taylor. In opposition of the Bill, what I wanted to look at is the vision is what do we want in the future? Do we want. Yes, we failed with alcohol and people drink, people get drunk and people crash cars. What do you want? 20 years from now, people walking around high and crashing cars.

We gave up with alcohol and seemed like we lost the battle. But with Marijuana, we still have a chance. So if we don't pass this Bill, maybe we can fix what's already broken. Yeah, we know that it's easy to get weed, but do we want to keep it that way? Just look at tomorrow, not just today.

Thank you.

Thank you very much. Anybody else on the fifth row? Okay, come on up.

Hi, I'm with the Department of Health, so you please identify yourself. I'm Lindy Le, the acting program manager for the Office of Medical Cannabis Control and Regulation. You have our written testimony, apologies, but we have submitted and we offer comments, particularly our concerns about the public health impacts with the increased access to cannabis.

But the Department does appreciate that there is strong regulatory framework that can help protect public health and safety. We also. I'd like to also point out that we referenced the wrong. The wrong Bill and we apologize for that.

But we did submit for SB 1613 and my Vice Chair pointed out you did submit it, but for some reason it's not on my list. Okay, thank you very much. It is on the website, though. Thank you very much. Okay, next up on the fifth row, who hasn't testified. Okay, last row. Wait second. Angela.

No, no, no, Come on up. They've been waiting here a lot longer than you have.

Martin Choi, retired. When I was working, I had an injured co worker who lived only to be high on the job. And I watched him sacrifice his whole future. But that was his. He did not have any motivation or desire to. To.

So you're in opposition?

Yes, I'm in opposition, yes. And so he. I watched his life just amount to nothing because he had numerous opportunities to advance, but he would rather just drift off in on a high on the job. So I'm in opposition to it. And he became an instant instigator to have parties. And so it.

It's a peer pressure that caused people to. Thank you very much. Stick to it.

Thank you. Okay, anybody else who hasn't testified on the fifth row, last row. Anybody in the last row hasn't testified? Okay, Angie. Okay, come on up. Wait a second. Not yet. Come on up at the very end, I see.

Aloha. My name is Margaret Mehan. I'm representing Hawaii Christian Coalition. Hawaii Christian coalition has approximately 35,000 Members. If you add the spouses and children, we represent about 130,000 people. People. I strongly oppose HSB 1613 relating to cannabis. These points are taken from statistics from states who have legalized Marijuana. Substantial rise in the cost of rent for residents.

So in Hawaii, we already have a housing crisis. I don't think we want to add to that. Drug dealers move into states where Marijuana has been legalized. They bring in prostitution, sex trafficking, more lethal drugs, including fentanyl. Crimes, crimes and more crimes. I don't think HPD is ready to deal with all this.

And then also someone also brought up all the traffic incidents and so the hospitals as well, especially the emergency room. High school dropout rate increases. I work with teens. I've seen lots of consequences in the juvenile facility in Kapolei as well as the very much. Well, I have one last thing to say.

Legalizing marijuana will not bring 40 million into Hawaii. Instead, it would bring in lots of crimes.

Thank you very much. Anybody else who hasn't testified? Okay, Angela, come on up. You got one minute.

Angela. Melody Young testifying in opposition on behalf of Kapalama Neighborhood Security Watch, a grassroots movement of the Honolulu Police Department. I'm a safety coordinator, so initiating this discussion on Marijuana has brought together people from all sides.

And as a Christian who has friends who go to Burning man festivals and Coachellas, I'm personally conflicted with dealing with the pressure of having to say and do what's trendy versus what's good for public safety and public health. Marijuana as a medical legalization is good enough, as is for people who are suffering from pain and anxiety.

So I personally am opposed to this. To the recreational youth, common illnesses such as degenerative disc conditions and spinal injuries for back pain can be alleviated from medical Marijuana. And joint pain and also headaches can be something that are common illnesses that get resolved for medical Marijuana use.

Thank you very much.

Legalizing it. Thank you. Recreational is too much.

Anybody else who hasn't testified? Who? Okay, Members, any questions? Okay, seeing none. Moving on to decision making. Sure. zero, you have a question? Okay. Senator Steve. Okay, let's limit it to one minute, please.

Besides the. The impact already, what you guys talked about over here, what about the states that is suffering now for the young children that is addicted to mental illness like Colorado?

I know talking to you guys about this before, but what is the statistics that you know now some of the states that is regretting it, even though they're not going to change it, but they're regretting it now. And one of them is Colorado.

Right. What research has come out in November? A meta survey of all of the other surveys. It has shown that with teens you have a 13% increase in use and with young adults it's 22. An earlier speaker talked about research showing a declination. That was a couple of years ago.

Nora Volkov, head of the National Institute of Drug Abuse, was the introducer for that study two years ago. She came out last month, January of 25, to say because the methodology was flawed, that research is no good. So we have more young people using it, we have more young adults and it's associated with schizophrenia.

It's associated with suicidal ideation and it, it just causes more, more problems. So I think that's short answer.

Thank you very much. Thank you. Okay. Okay, go ahead.

I have a question for a prosecutor too. Okay. Senator Rhodes, curiosity about the methodology on that study. Did they look at states that still. Where it's still illegal? Like what was the increase in use in states that were still illegal?

What I saw in it, they looked at states that had legalized. Okay, so they didn't try to compare it. Well, that, that they're smoking at 13% more than the states that did not legalize it.

And I think not compared to what I thought. I thought the comparison was before that it was legalized.

My understand it was 13% higher than the states that did not legalize. And the method.

What was it before it was legalized then?

Right. The states that have legalized 13% more teenagers age 12 to 17 use Marijuana than in states that have not legalized it.

What were, what was the comparison before the states that legalized. Legalized. Because there's no. I'm not sure that means anything.

Okay, well, if you live in a state that legalized, you're gonna have more of your teens. Yeah. But if you're smoking than you didn't.

If you hadn't legalized, you might have had more teens smoking anyway.

Well, that's the comparison group that is third. That is lower now.

Okay. Okay. So a totally different question. So a couple of people have testified today that crime rates are going up. Is that. I don't believe that's true.

Well, I think it's. Fatal car collisions have gone up.

No, I'm not talking about Pacolo. I'm talking about in General. People are saying that.

I think it's. They're looking at. They're more robberies of stores like we saw on TV here. Somebody takes a stolen truck and reverses it into an electric bike store. They have a lot more robberies like that who are. Where they steal the product. You have cartels that are coming in from Maine to California.

What you had indicated to me before. My understanding. My understanding was that crime was. Crime is going down on Oahu. Okay.

zero, no crime. No question. Crime is going down overall on Oahu, but we don't have it legalized now, so.

Okay. Okay, thank you. Thank you very much. Any more questions? Seeing none, let's proceed with decision making. Okay. For SB 1613, you have the both sheets. Okay. Chair's recommendation is. I. I know it's a work in progress. Everybody wants to put in amendments. Chair's recommendation is to pass with only tech amendments and a defective date.

It's a work in progress. We'll see how far it goes with all the amendments that probably the House and later on the Senate again will put on it. But right now we're just going to pass it only with tech amendments and a defective date. Any comments, questions or concerns? Seeing none. Vice Chair for the vote.

Pass with amendments.

Okay, passing with amendments. Chair. Aye. Vice Chair votes. Reservation Reservations. Senator Hashimoto. Senator Keokolole. It's excused, sir. Favela. So recommendation is adopted.

Same recommendation for jdc. Any questions or concerns? Sure, go ahead. Senator. A law.

Yeah, real quick. There's probably not a lawmaker in this building who wants to legalize Marijuana as much as I do, nor know the benefits as much as I do, but after reading this Bill, this is. This puts. Doesn't give us the freedoms while.

While people would be able to use and not have to fear to go to jail, it doesn't support local selling. This. This is more towards benefits of corporations. So with that, I'll be voting up.

All right, Other questions or concerns. If not. Senator Gabbard for the vote.

Chair's recommendation on SB 1613 is to pass an amendment. Chair Rose. Vice Chair. Vote Snow. Senator Chang. Aye. Senator Sanbona Ventura. Aye. Senator awa. No. The measure passes. Thank you very much.

And with that, we are adjourned.

Thank you, folks.