Senate Standing Committee on Health and Human Services

Good afternoon. The day after Super Bowl Day and I hope that the millions of people that were on television, some will be with us today. Anyway, the Committee on Water and Land, it's on its notice of hearing today, Monday 10th February, and we are in room 229.

Just some housekeeping announcements for all the testifiers, including those on Zoom. We ask that you stand on your written testimony and if it's different from your written testimony, the time limit for each testifier will be two minutes.

And just to also add that the hearing notice of copies of the bills and the testimony can be found on the Legislature's website. The video stream of this hearing can be found on the Senate's YouTube channel. And for those of you who are viewing and who are here, here in present, I stand alone.

However, we are all busy people. This week is deadline week and you will see Members coming in, but we will get our job done. We'll proceed with SB561. And this is relating to conservation enforcement. Appropriate funds for equipment for the Oahu Branch of the Division of Conservation and Resources Enforcement of the Department of Land and Natural Resource.

DLNR Odokir.

Good afternoon. Good afternoon. Chair Dawn Shang, on behalf of the Department of Land and Natural Resources, we support this measure and stand on our residential school.

Okay, Very good. Thank you. Mahalo. Conservation Council for Hawaii. Jonetta Peters. Okay. Pu Ohoku Ranch, Malama Pupukea, Waimea Ocean Reef and Ocean Coalition. Ted Wolin. Okay. Just to let you know that this is a good Bill. I'm sure we have 18 inch support. No opposition on this measure or SB561.

Is there anyone else wishes to speak to SB561? Okay. Hearing none. Let's see. The chair would like to take a moment and ask. My Senate President is here and we accept and welcome him to my hearings.

And if you can also recognize that there is a measure that perhaps if I am correct, that Senate President would like to hear his measure. I will do that because he is a very busy person. Shall I go ahead and take care? Okay. All right, we will proceed then. We will take in, let's see, SB465.

And this is relating to the Kiki Aola Small Boat Harbor. This requires the Department of Land and Natural Resources to conduct a study of the carrying capacity of Kiki Aola Small boat Harbor on the County of Kauai and it requires a report to the Legislature. Okay. D and on.

Thank you. Chair Inouye. Dawn Shang, on behalf of the Department of Land and Natural Resources, we support the intent of this Bill, because we would only ask that we are in the process of completing a $4.1 million capital improvement project, and perhaps the caring Capacity study might be best done at that time.

But again, we support the intent of the Bill as President. Kochi has discussed this in the past with me and I know how important it is for him. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you, Chair. President. Senator Kochi, good afternoon.

Welcome. Thank you. Chair Enoy. I'm here as Senator For Senate District 8, the Islands of Kauai and Niihau. And while I understand that the improvements are being put in, the reason for the Bill is that two years ago when we met on Kauai, it was identified that there is a loophole in the rules on issuing permits.

And if you had a permit for a 12 passenger, 18 passenger tour craft, there is no requirement to get an approval to go up to 49, which is below triggering a Coast Guard permit.

So many of these operators who have had permits for a lot less passengers are all rushing to convert to craft that carry between 40 and 49. And whether it's restrooms, parking, or the natural resource of the Nepali coast itself, it is being overrun.

And the only way that we could make good decisions is if in fact we have what would be carrying capacity so we can establish rational nexus by which we would have permitted passengers going on the highway. And then while I'm here, the next one on Hanalei is a good one. And I think everybody will agree with that.

This I know, will have controversy. I acknowledge that. Because tour operators would like to continue to enjoy the loophole that they have. And I think that if we're finding a balance for the environment and the economy, this would be needed. Thank you.

Okay. And this is a study. So I think it's good time to get back and have a study completed. Thank you. Okay. While we're on SB465 and you spoke on behalf of Megan. Yeah. Or you want to stand by the Department. Okay. All right, let's see.

Testifying for the office of county Clerk Council Services Division and the County of Kauai. And this is Council Member Edison Bulosan, sans communication in support. Purple Maya foundation in support. And we have one more. Darren Dizon in Support. It is Mr. Kubo on Zoom.

Yes, he's present chair.

Okay.

Clayton Aloha collecting Kubo Waimea, Kauai. I see this measure as unnecessary because we are additional boat ramps is going to be put in into Kiki'ola. Adjacent landowner is building a parking lot. So I say that this Bill, this measure is like five to seven years too late. Yes, five to seven years too late.

It's just a waste of time and money. Mahalo nui. Aloha.

Okay. Aloha, Clayton. Next testimony it on Zoom. And this is Kim not present on Zoom.

Chair.

Okay. Sans communication. In opposition as well. Okay. Calden Yagin, Eric Coke and Nick Croft in opposition. Is there anyone else wishes to speak to SB465? Seeing none, hearing none. We'll proceed then with the second item on the agenda. We will proceed with SB 1456. And this is relating to the restoration of beachlands.

It amends the definition of beach restoration to include activities undertaken to maintain and improve eroded beaches and degraded dune systems through the management of sand and native vegetation, placement of sand, and activities undertaken to remove abandoned and remnant materials that pose a risk to public and ecosystem health. Okay. On SB 1457. DLNR.

Thank you very much, Chair Inouye and Members of the Committee. Dawn Chang on behalf of the Department of Land and Natural Resources. This is an administrative bill and we strongly support it, as it will broaden the definition of breach restoration to be aligned with the different options that we have available. Thank you.

Mahalo. The University of Hawaii System, Dolan Eversole.

Aloha, Chair, Members of the Committee. I'm Dolan Eversole. University of Hawaii will stand on our written testimony in support.

Mahalo. Surfrider Foundation, Hanna Lilley. Okay. And Rick Egged with Waikiki Beach Special Improvement District. Okay. Anyone else here wishes to speak on SB 1456? Hearing none. Let's proceed. SB 1460, relating to updating public land leases issued pursuant to Chapter 171 HRS.

And it requires that lease extensions approved by DLNR be drafted on forms that reflect contemporary leasing practices and policies of the board and which shall control over conflicting or inconsistent provisions in the lease being extended. Okay. DLNR

Good afternoon, Chair Inouye, members of the committee. Dawn Chang, on behalf of the Department of Land and Natural Resources. This is an administrative bill and we stand in strong support of the bill that would require all these extensions to comply with the updated lease terms. And we stand on our written testimony. Thank you.

Thank you. Just a question. This is updating on the current form? Yes. The new form that has been in the works for some time. Yeah. And that's a great thing to do to review many, matter of fact, all agencies should continue to review their method of processing, including some improvements.

And I think this is wonderful and we appreciate DLNR to look at it as well. Okay. Russell Tsuji, Same. Okay. All right. We're on the same page. SB 1460. Anyone here wishes to speak on SB 1460. Okay, hearing none and seeing none. Let's proceed to SB 1517. This is relating to public lands.

And this authorizes the DLNR to lease public lands for recreational residential use by public lottery and restrict participation in the public lottery to residents of the county in which the leased land land is located. DLNR parks.

Good afternoon, Chair Inouye, members of the committee, Dawn Chang, on behalf of the Department of Land and Natural Resources. We support this measure at this time. It applies to Kōke’e Cabins, but it could have broader implications beyond that. Thank you very much.

Thank you. Kōke’e Leaseholder Association. Chipper Wichman, are you there? Chipper? As IT?

Yeah, I'm here. Aloha. Can you hear me?

Yes.

Okay. Aloha, Senator Inouye and co Chair Elefante. Thank you, and committee members, thank you for the opportunity to add to my testimony. I stand on my written testimony and just want to say that I'm in awe of the diverse testimony that you've received in support of this bill.

The testifiers that are before you today, mostly in writing, come from all walks of life and nearly all of the rural communities on the island of Kauai. You can truly see how important this bill is to our people here.

For the past five years, I've worked closely with State Park's leadership, Alan Carpenter, Kurt Cottrell, and Chair Chang, to develop essential reforms to how State Park manages the unique historic resource of these recreational residents. While it's not perfect, SB 1517 is a major step in that direction.

How we care for this 100-year-old unique resource that's not replicated anywhere else in our pa'ina it's critical for our future generations. Thank you for the chance to testify today, and I urge you to support SB 1517. Mahalo.

Mahalo, Chipper. Kōke’e Leaseholders Association. Joanne Acoba. In support. We have received 58 supporters and no opposition. Is there anyone else wishes to speak to SB 1517? Question to Chair Chang. I understand that there, there are some of the older units that has been, over time, kind of like, I shouldn't say dilapidated, because I think people are leasing those cabins. So did we ever make improvements to those that needed renovations?

No. I'll also ask. I think Alan Carpenter is here. But we recently, so the most recent public auction that we had were on some of those properties that were dilapidated, but we have not made any improvements on these parcels. Alan can confirm, they are made improvements that have all been made by the tenants.

Okay, so then the question is, because this is market rents, that's correct, right?Or up to date, or maybe not market, appraisals. So your appraisal for those dilapidated cabins, did it appear like almost similar to the appraisal of the nice cabins and hopefully that we hear that probably the leasing has been adjusted?

Yeah, good question, Chair. Alan Carpenter, Assistant Administrator for State Parks. The appraised value of the most dilapidated cabins at this most recent auction basically equated to the land value only. Right? And so as Chair Chang mentioned, right, they need a lot of work. They have always been, the maintenance and even the construction thereof was always in the hands of the lessees.

Right? So, I mean, I think one of the reasons that we need this bill, is these cabins were not built by the state. These cabins were all built by Kauai families over a hundred years. Right?

And so the leases still put the maintenance in the hands of the lessees. It's their responsibility. This also, this bill incentivizes that by letting the people who have them now be assured that they'll be able to continue to be able to afford them in the next lease period.

It's a beautiful place. Just, you know, and I'm sure. And the turnover on the lease, like the expirations, how long, like?

20 years, maximum.

Okay.

Right. And we just did. The ones we just leased out are on a seven year term, and that was to sync them up with the expiration dates of the remainder of them.

So can the leaseholders do improvements themselves?

Absolutely. And they are.

So they have to abide by the county's permitting system and whatever.

And there, we have guidelines because they are a historic community, right? So there's rehabilitation guidelines that we provide to lessees.

Senator, your question is well noted because I think what we notice in this last around, we could not issue them by lottery only public auction.

Right.

So while some of these were very dilapidated and the value was market rate 5,000, some of these went all the way up to $41,000 pursuant to the, to the public option bid.

So it really outpaced the local residents who could not afford to keep up with that. So this is an attempt to recognize those, in the community on Kauai in particular, who have, who do view Koke'e as one of the treasures on Kauai, and they have a real commitment to maintaining them and seeds of value.

So this bill is really an attempt to sort of level that, create equity and create fairness for everybody on Kauai. Thank you for the question.

Good job. All right, thank you. Yeah. There's not too many treasures like that particular campsite for its longevity. Yeah. Now that I have you, is there any other parks in the state that do the same thing? Well, we don't have too many cabins around our state. Well, we do in my island, Hapuna. But you don't lease it. Right? Sit down.

Sorry.

It comes to mind because.

So the recreational residence is a unique form of lease. It doesn't allow you to live in them and it is not sort of the week long transient rental. Right? You, you have that cabin in your possession for up to 20 years, but you cannot live there. So it's essentially they become weekend and holiday amenities for families.

And again, originally, many of the families, Chipper is one of them, right, they, they built those cabins before I was born. Right. And so they have remained in the family through these various lease periods.

But some of the missteps in the history of this process for determining who gets them have caused families to lose their cabins over the years. And we're trying to correct that and bring that.

All right, thank you so much. Is there anyone else wishes to speak to SB 1517? Hearing none, seeing none as well. And the chair would like to. And members, if you weren't here. We did take in SB 465 earlier with Senate President, the introducer of the mayor. I mean the introducer of the mayor, introducer of this bill, SB 465.

However, I am sorry. I thought I did call others to testify in SB 465, but I understand that we have Taryn Dizon. Are you still on Zoom, IT? Aloha, Taryn. Sorry about the neglect of calling you earlier.

Thank you, Chair. I appreciate you making this time. Can you hear me? Everything's good? Thank you, Aloha, Chair Inouye and Vice Chair Elefante and the Members of the Committee on Water and Land. I'm testifying in strong support of Senate Bill 465, which requires the Department of Land and Natural Resources to conduct a carry capacity study.

It is very alarming that Kikiaola Small Boat harbor holds approximately 60% of the commercial boat permits for the entire island of Kauai. Housing such a large proportion of commercial activities at this small harbor has created constant safety concerns, limited recreational access, and strained resources.

The additional logistical challenges of hosting 60% of the island's commercial operations are compounded by permit holders frequently changing their vessels to increase their carrying capacity, as Senate President mentioned earlier. Historically the harbor's permits were capped at 10 for decades. In the past decade, this has grown to over 25 state issued permits.

Our key safety concerns are the safety risk, the environmental impact, as the increased commercial activities is harming marine ecosystem, as Senate President mentioned, as well as the community impact that the challenges are negatively affecting the local community, particularly our recreational fishermen and residents of Kekaha.

Conducting this study for the Kikiaola Small Boat Harbor will ensure sustainable and safe operations balancing commercial and recreational activities as Senate President and Chair Chang mentioned. Thank you for the opportunity to comment on this measure and create this time. Thank you.

Okay, so Taryn, you're in support of the measure?

In support. In strong support.

All right, Mahalo. Thank you. Okay, Members, let's proceed to SB 1511. And this is relating to Hanalei Bay. And this prohibits vessels longer than 75ft from entering Hanalei Bay. It exempts vessels operated by a federal, state or county agency. Thank you, Chair.

Vice Chair. On behalf of the Department Financial Resources, we have provided comments and we stand on our.

Thank you. Kim Palinski. Okay. In support as well, anyone else wishes to speak to SB Ventures 1511 Members, any questions on this measure? Okay, hearing none, seeing none. Let's proceed to SB 1019. And this is relating to the Ocean Special Fund.

This authorizes the Ocean Stewardship Special Fund to be used for planning, development, designing, or implementation of beach restoration projects. This includes the awarding of grants to nonprofit organizations for beach and nearshore environmental cleanup. Okay, DLNR.

I'm going to come up to the desk because I've got a little bit more I'd like to say. Good afternoon, Senator Inouye, Senator Elefante, and Members of the Committee. Dawn Chang on behalf of the Department of Land and Natural Resources. We have provided written comments, but I'd like to just briefly explain. There are two special funds within DLNR.

One is managed by OCCL and that's the Beach Restoration Program and Beach Restoration Special Fund. We also have another fund managed by the Department of Aquatic Resources, the Ocean Stewardship Special Fund. They both have different missions. I think the intent of this bill is better aligned with OCCL's Beach Restoration Special Fund. And that's what we would propose.

That's consistent with our testimony. The Ocean Recreation Special Fund under DAR was just recently established. We generate maybe $1 million, and that's really designed for like coral restoration, marine management. And we think the better fund for beach restoration is under our OCCL Beach Restoration Special Fund. Thank you very much.

All right, any Members to feel comfortable in asking the Chair any concerns or questions you may have. Denver Coon on Zoom. Are you still with us every day? We're getting very active. Aloha.

Thank you, Chair. Good afternoon. Aloha. And Vice Chair, Members of the Committee. Denver Coon on behalf of the Ocean Tourism Coalition. We stand on our written testimony and our agreement with the comments made by DLNR.

In opposition?

Yes, yes. And again, that's just based on the, you know, the original intent of the Ocean Stewardship Fee, making sure the funds go to those projects first before they're allocated to other projects beyond the scope of the original intent.

Thank you. Thank you so much. Okay. Maui Trailer Boat Club, Ben Walin, in support. As well as the Sea Maui Fun Charters, Island Scuba in support. Kimeona Kane in support, and Kendrick Chang in support.Oppositions. The Maui Hotel and Lodging Association. Opposition from the Calypso Charters. And Members, they were pretty much almost even seven in...

I mean, four in support and three in opposition. Members, any questions you have on this measure? Thank you. We'll proceed then with... We're moving along. SB 565, and this is relating to Pololu Valley management efforts on Hawaii islands. This appropriates... 1457. No, 1019. We just finished. Right. Okay. All right. Okay, we will.

Yes, I want to get action going. SB 1457 relating to ocean user safety. And this authorizes BLNR to issue interim rules regarding commercial and recreational use of water sports equipment. So, Elnr, are you next?

Yes, I am. Okay. Good afternoon. Sherry Noy, Vice Chair of the Fonte and Members of the Committee, Dawn Chang representing the Department of Land and Natural Resources. This is an administrative Bill, and we strongly support this. I think it's a little misnomer. This is not just regulating equipment. It is really our adaptive management Bill.

It permits Dobar to more quickly adopt interim rules when there's a changed circumstance, whether it's new equipment, whether it could be coral bleaching, whether it could be, you know, a dramatic increase in use that may affect the environment, but it permits us to more quickly respond.

We still have to have this in a public meeting before the land Board, and then we have to adopt permanent rules. But this is our adaptive management rule that's already been approved by for Division of Aquatic Resources and Division of Forestry and Wildlife.

Okay, thank you. All right. I think you got competition on this one. Cheer. Yes. Maui Wing Foaling and Windsurfing Facebook page administrator Eli Spivak on Zoom. Eli or Ellie.

I am here. It's Ellie Spivak. Thank you very much, Chair. And thank you, Committee Members, for having me. I stand by my testimony and I oppose this Bill, I don't believe that a change in the measure from a 120 day period to a two year period makes sense.

And this Bill seems specifically targeted towards the foiling community, whether that be the efoil vessels or the recreational equipment. As far as prone foiling, wing foiling and other such foil craft. I am the administrator of Maui Wing Foil and Wing Surfing Facebook page.

We do have an advocacy group and we have worked with the harbour master in Kahului as well as other stakeholders and we feel that we have gone to great lengths to try and bipono with all of the stakeholders and we have issued daily reports as to when it's possible to wing foil in the harbor and we promote wing foiling safety through videos and through written pamphlets and the like.

So we are opposed to this change in from the 120 day to the two year period and we feel that the use for this is vague and we would be more than happy to work directly with DOBOR and DLNR and come up with any kind of solution that they feel there's a need for.

Thank you so much and thanks for hearing my testimony.

Thank you. Eli. It There seems to be probably two more on Zoom and we'll take Alica Ferreira. Aloha. Alika, is that you?

Yeah, that's me. Mahalo Chair, Vice Chair and Committee Members. My name is Alika Ferreira and I oppose SB 1457. I was born, raised and currently reside in Kailua on the island of Oahu. I'm very aware of the many advances in technology and around water sport equipment.

I operate a small business conducting e foil and wing foil lessons on Oahu. This Bill is proposing a new process of making rules that would negatively affect ocean activities. I oppose this Bill because it appears to me that this Bill aims to accelerate the process of making rules, increase the Board's power and reduce public participation.

The proposed process would be exempt from HRS Chapter 91, which are the administrative procedures. Within Chapter 91 there already exists the emergency rulemaking process for the purpose of addressing imminent peril to the public health and safety.

The existing emergency rulemaking process allows for a maximum duration of four months without renewal, while SB 1457 asks for a 24 month duration and allows for renewal.

My opinion is that this Bill would allow for the Board to rush a rule into place, let IT stand for 24 months and then do it again to extend the duration of a rule indefinitely, all without the requirement of a 30 day public notice to allow for public participation.

In my opinion, public participation is required In a representative democracy, limiting the power of any regulatory body is essential. We don't need another rulemaking process. I urge you to vote no to SB 1457. At the start of this hearing, I counted 88 testimonials submitted in written format in opposition to this Bill and only two in support.

Mahalo for your time today.

Mahalo. Alika John Mccabe on Zoom not present on Zoom Chair okay, Kihei Holiday Surf Club I will announce the associations with regards to this measure on SB 1457.

Kihei holiday surf Club in opposition Boss Frogs dive and surf Mike Kelly of the Akalani beach and Ocean Recreation Kyla Barker, Kanaha Kai, Maui in opposition Pamela Tumpak, Maui Chamber of Commerce in opposition Christina Jadson, Kailua Wind Sports Associations Many individuals have written in opposition in this measure. 3 in a support 88 in opposition.

Is anyone else wishing to speak or on SB 1457? Kate, I'm sorry I did not call you, but you have sent your testimony. Aloha.

Good afternoon Chair Noye. Good afternoon Vice Chair and the rest of the Members. My name is Kate Thompson. I'm an avid sailor with 25 years experience with my boat at the Alawai Boat harbor. And I have been. I stand by my testimony opposing this and the reason why is similar to Ikaika. Exactly.

But I wanted to add that the board is very busy. They have full day agendas. They have 400 pages to read in 24 hours. And I find that they, they can't really go deep into the details of contracts or nuances of administrative rules.

And an example of this is that we've been working to prevent predatory towing, essentially state sanctioned predatory towing. We have 200. We have 2,000 cars towed every year at Alawai Boat harbor for the past three years and 1000 in Maui and only seven parking tickets given by Docare.

Even though do Care is responsible for giving tickets as they testified in 2022 that Do Care gives the tickets and. But they don't. So we would like the parking people to give tickets but we've even filed contested case hearings trying to go deeper on the subject and solve it for the public.

But the board is reluctant to do so. I would also say if the power does move to the board that the Chairman be ex officio and only vote if there's a tie between board Members. Thank you.

Thanks. Okay. Anyone else wishes to speak to SB 1457 hearing? None. Will continue on. Yes. Senator Elefante, DLNR Chair thank you, Chair Chen.

Thank you.

Yeah, I know in the, I know in past sessions there were similar bills I believe at an admin bill. Right. So currently in your emergency rule process it's 120 days. Has that emergency rule expired for. For this? So have you set up any emergency rules relating to this?

So Megan Stats, I'm the boating administrator for the division of voting. So we have not done emergency rulemaking specifically for anything we are not targeting. Contrary to some of the testimony, we're not targeting efoils. We're just trying to address activities that happen in certain areas that cause safety issues.

And the emergency rules for 120 days is not long enough. And that's the reason why we're trying to get the same type of authority that already has for forestry, state parks and aquatic resources because rulemaking itself takes one to two years and bless you.

And as a follow up to that, I know there's a lot of testimony and opposition from the E Foiling community. Has Dylan R and Dhobar reached out to Members from the efoiling Community.

We have had many conversations with E Foilers. Foilers. E Foilers. But at this point, this is not. Again, this is not directed specifically at E Foils.

Okay, thank you. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Any further questions? Yes, Senator McKelvey of Maui.

Keep it quick. It just seems overly broad. I could see this being misapplied, like keeping. Keeping surfboards out of Honolulu Bay, all sorts of places. The snorkeling thing came up. Did you look at some of the testimony was in opposition. However they were asking for amendments. Have you looked at that at all?

I was not able to look through the testimony in the House side. We did talk about possibly doing instead of two years, maybe it's valid for say just 12 months rather than 24 months as a Shorter period.

Because I think that's where some of the concerns are is that it's for two years and then it expires or that there's no due process. And we're still going through the board of Land and Natural Resources. So everybody's due process is still being heard. They have the opportunity to do so.

But I haven't read through all of the testimony to know specifically.

It's pretty wide open. I mean, any immediate threat to natural resources. You could cite all sorts of things for some of the examples I gave. So I think, you know, for the community, especially since the. There's quite concern you could have a registration program for every surfboard in the state.

Things like this where people should be able to testify. Right. The parking thing that came up, which I never would have thought of. So anyway, I appreciate you hopefully considering down the road, you know, some limitations on the measure. Thanks, Chair.

Thank you. Senator. If I can just ask a final comment, especially on on Maui, I mean, we have received several lawsuits that we haven't done 343. So the continued issuance of new more permits is going to expose everybody to essentially stopping all activity. I mean, my recollection is that Mr. Ferreira, he has completed. He's a permit. Right.

But not everybody gets a permit. So I mean, I think we're trying to find a balance here. We won't. I know it's not going to be good for everybody, but I think we are trying to get ahead of the game. We. With respect to environmental concerns as well.

Yeah. You know, with regards to that lawsuit, it's kind of interesting because it seems like it was targeting just one particular district, I guess on Maui. Kanapali. Yeah.

It was out of the fish collectors in west Hawaii.

This is Kanapali.

Yeah, I understand. But they wanted that same theory of law.

But my question is, my concern is that particular suit now applies overall. Everybody. Yes. And I think that's an issue we're kind of dealing with. Okay, thank you. All right. Thank you so much. Thank you. Okay, we will go to the Big island now relating to Pololu Valley management efforts on Hawaii Island.

This appropriates monies for Pololu Valley management, including the Division of Forestry and Wildlife of DLNR to develop the trailhead, develop the infrastructure necessary to accommodate parking, install appropriate informational, historical, and educational signage, design and construct restroom facilities, and establish positions to manage the trail area. DLNR.

Thank you. I'll stand here. Dawn Chang. Good afternoon, Senator and Vice Chair, Members of the Committee. Dawn Chang on behalf of the Department of Land and Natural Resources. We stand in strong support of this measure and we stand on our written testimony.

Thank you very much. Mahalo. Okay. Kekoa Kealoha. Aloha. Thank you for being here.

Aloha, Chair, Vice Chair, and Members of the Committee. My name is Kekoa Kealoha. I submitted testimony as an individual, but I'm actually here to represent the Protect Pololu Hui. We are a community based group that has been heavily involved in the stewardship of the Pololu trailhead and the community efforts led to kind of manage the overgrowth and the over visitation that happens at Pololu. And we are in strong support of this bill because we have been heavily involved in the development of the land management plan.

And we also feel that the land management plan is a really good example of a strong state and community partnership that can help alleviate both the burden on the county as well as the state and put some of the stewardship and some of the autonomy back into communities' hands. And we are very honored to have been a part of that and are very thankful to Senator Richards for putting this bill forward. But thank you very much. And I have nothing further to add.

I think I have a question for you. Okay. But you don't live there now though?

I go back very often, but yes, I live here now.

That used to be in my district before I was redistricted to go home to Hilo two years ago. However, and Pololu Valley or the entire North Kohala is also in our family. However, just some questions that I would like to ask you because, at one time, what happened to the developer that wanted to give some property in exchange for something I guess they wanted to build elsewhere? Is that ongoing or whatever happened to that arrangement? I had some concerns with that particular proposal, but I'd like to hear where it's at.

Yes. So our group has met with a private land buyer who did purchase a large partial and a part of it does overlook the valley. I don't have his particular permission to share his name and stuff, but I'm happy to share. I think you'll also hear from Jackson Bauer, who is.

Looks like he's on Zoom, who might be able to speak a little bit further about it. But we are working with him to actually donate a portion of his parcel so that we can actually move the parking lot to an area where it's safer and construct. It's, do you know where the mule station is? It's right there.

But it's not right close by to the trailhead.

It's not the actual lookout. It's actually set further back.

Okay. All right. But we thank the community though because you guys are the... Actually, it's kind of interesting. It's, I wouldn't say similar to the issue that we had at the parks in on Kauai where the community took over the Low E areas, but I think this is long overdue. I think it's overwhelming.

When I visited many times there, and it's still congested. But I think establishing this... But I still believe, I think purchasing a property for parking should be the priority. Because if you improve the trailhead and visitors are still gonna go there, no parking elsewhere. And it's very stressful, I think.

Yeah.

Hopefully we can develop. There was another proposal that I thought we should probably continue discussions with the Sproat family, who's right there. And because of the generations now, because they have two properties. And if we can... And maybe I can talk to DLNR and see how we can, because that's a perfect site. You don't have to park your car and then walk down, make the turn. But right there, I think you need parking and you need restrooms.

Right. And so that's part of the land management plan, actually. And I think it's linked in the testimony from the DLNR that shows exactly where the restrooms would be, how the parking lot would be structured. And also, so our stewards that manage the trailhead at the top actually manage the parking situation really, really well, even with the current situation now. So parking issues have actually reduced significantly as well as rescues that have had to happen in the valley. And also just the information that visitors need to stay safe when they visit. And that's a testament, really, to the stewardship program that's at the trailhead.

Okay. The community is still together?

Oh, yes. Five years strong.

Yes. All right. Thank you. Okay. Yes.

Jackson is on the line. Maybe he can answer any question.

Good. Okay, Jackson, you're online on Zoom. Aloha.

Aloha, everyone. Jackson Bauer, Trail and Access Program Manager for Hawaii Island, part of Division Forestry and Wildlife under DLNR. Yeah, so to answer some of those questions, actually, Kekoa said it perfectly about the plan. And there's a link on the testimony to take you to the plan if you'd like to look in detail.

This was collaboration of several years with the community, really listening to what they are observing there and what is important to the community's needs. And so the beauty is at the mule station, it is actually has a good viewing plane from there as well.

So we'll be able to kind of shift things, set things back a little bit, give some breathing room to Pololu. As you know, it's a very sacred space. It's very important to the community. And the congestion that's at that tight current parking area doesn't mesh well with the sanctity of the area.

So having that space set back at the mule station is kind of a win win for everyone. Something that I can't talk about too much right now because it's literally in the works as we're speaking. But we are in discussions with that mule station landowner that Kekoa mentioned into donating that parcel to us. So that is happening soon. So, yeah, so that's some good news. And as that happens, that will, you know, this bill will allow us to actually implement the plan on that parcel.

Sure. Thank you. Thank you so much for all you folks do for communities. All right. We do have three in support as well, so five total. No opposition. Is there anyone wishing to speak to SB 565? Okay, we'll move on to SB 1462, relating to the state Historic Preservation Income Tax Credit.

And this reenacts the Historic Preservation Income Tax Credit, establishes a cap of the tax credit at $1.0 million for taxable year 2025 to taxable year 2030 respectively, and repeals the tax credit on December 31, 2030. Who wants to go first, DLNR or tax office? Okay. DLNR. All right.

I'm so sorry, but there was someone else.

Okay.

So good afternoon, Chair and Vice Chair, members of the committee, Dawn Chang, on behalf of the Department. This is an admin bill and we stand in strong support. I also have Jessica Puff, the SHPD administrator, if you have any questions. Thank you.

Thank you. Department of Taxation. Sends testimony in support. Historic Hawaii foundation, in support. Climate Protectors Hawaii, Ted Bohlen, in support. Is there anyone wishing to speak to SB 1462? And by the way, this measure on the admin bill, I think is a welcome sign for moving along. That's a good bill. All right. Okay. I understand.

I think I called many others to testify for SB 1457. Is Mr. Mccabe on Zoom? IT?

Yes, she is present on zoom.

Okay. And Mr. Mccabe wants to speak on SB 1457. John, are you there? IT? IT, did you say Mr. Mccabe is there? Otherwise, we'll be moving along and you just let us know. SB 1602, relating to the Keauhou Aquifer System, and this appropriates funds to DLNR Resources to install two monitoring wells in the Keauhou Aquifer System. This establishes the Keauhou Aquifer System Monitoring Program Report. Requires reports to the legislature. Okay, DLNR.

Thank you very much, Chair Inouye. Vice Char Elefante, members of the committee. Dawn Chang. I'm actually going to put on my Commission Chair of the Commission on Water Resource Management. So we strongly support this measure. We think it is a, it helps to develop a monitoring program in support of facilitating some of the projects that are going on in the Kona District

And getting our housing going.

Yes.

Yes. Well, I'm glad that with all the issues that has been in place for. Oh, I don't know if we've been fighting this for a year, but at least there's some way of trying to accommodate the additional developers and the developments that has been waiting in line. Hopefully nobody cancels.

Hopefully not. Yeah. No. So, okay, I think this is a good measure.

And now, do we have. Oh, maybe Dean is here. Yes, Come on up, Dean. Dean Minakami with HHFDC testifying. Yes.

Good afternoon, Chair, Vice Chair, members, Dean Minakami, Hawaii Housing Finance Development Corporation. We stand on our testimony in support. We have HHFDC's Kamakana Villages, which has been on hold due to lack of potable water. We're working with NELHA on development of a water well. But there have been community concerns, so this pilot program will help to address those concerns.

Okay. Will one of the monitoring wells be at NELHA? No?

NELHA has their own monitoring wells. So this would expand the network of monitoring wells.

To expand what's there at NELHA.

This would be not specific for NELHA.

What's the study part?

Well, these monitoring wells will help the water commission to determine the impact of developing new water sources.

Okay, so aside from the states projects that you know of, on the private, I understand those that are still waiting for water. How many projects? Aside from yours? From ours, the state, is on hold.

Oh, I think there are a number of projects or projects, for example, by Kamehameha Schools, Queen Liliuokalani Trust. I think Stafford CAR has other projects out there. So number of projects.

Knowing this has been an issue for many years, the monitoring well. So we don't know what the national park is going to do, then it'll probably still be on watch.

Yes.

Okay. All right. Thanks so much for being here. Okay. Laurence Sombardier, from NELHA. Are you on Zoom?

Aloha, Chair Inouye. Yeah. Laurence Sombardier, from NELHA. So we stand in support, we stand by our written testimony, which is in support. To answer the question you had a little bit earlier, where the wells would be. I believe they're looking at having them by Kona Bay. So the idea is that there's no monitoring capability down in that area. NELHA monitors the coast like Keahole Point, so we have full capability there.

But isn't Kona, can I ask you, isn't Kona Bay closer, though, to the old airport?

Correct.

Okay.

Senator?

Yes. Come on up.

If I may.

Sure.

Let me try to, address your question. So this.

Laurence, yeah, she's still on. She has time. But, no, that's okay, Chair. Because she probably could comment as well.

Okay. Do you want me to.

Yeah, no, you go ahead.

Okay, thank you. So I did want to, so this pilot program is to help identify where the gaps are. DAR has some monitoring wells. NELHA has the county. So this project is to help identify where some of those gap areas may be and then put, and then fund those.

So. And it's a collective effort. So we have been consulting with the various private landowners, NELHA, HHFDC, as well as the County Water Department to come up with a coordinated process for this.

Good, good. Okay. Continue, Laurence. On Zoom.

Yes.

Okay, you can continue. Sorry for this.

Oh, not a problem. That was it. I'm available for other questions if, if any other members of the committee have any.

All right, thanks so much. Okay. Department of Water Supply Hawaii County in support. And an individual, Douglas Perrine. Is there anyone else wishes to speak to SB 1602. Okay, we'll proceed. SB 830 relating to coastal zone management.

And this narrows the scope of the definition of the term development in coastal zone management law by excluding reconstruction of certain lawfully constructed structures impacted by certain events. Okay. Opsd. Aloha, Mary Alice. Thanks for Being here.

Good afternoon, Chair, Vice Chair and Members with me today is Chris Liu. He is our Program Planning Manager for the Coastal Zone Management Program in the Office of Planning and Sustainable Development. We want to offer an amendment to SB830, and we've included the full text in our testimony. It's similar.

That's what you have existing in your testimony, right?

That's correct. It's very similar. But we prefer this language and we recommend it to you.

Okay. All right. Now, with regards to the cesium process, and thanks for being here as well, this will also be actually a statewide issue, right? Yes.

Chapter 205a is a statewide Bill. It's a General, General law. So instead of putting something specific to Lahaina in a General law, we crafted language along with the county that would fit any disaster in these very narrow circumstances that were declared a disaster emergency by either the Governor or a mayor.

Okay. All right. And you know, Chair is Ian. Or you're going to testify on this. Okay. And you're going to be around, though, Mary Alice, stay here. Because it has to do with the. It has to do with the DLNR's testimony. Testimony as well. Okay, proceed.

Because there's a question I need to ask, and that question would be the recommendation on amendments from opsd. And you have recommendations as well. So I'm just wondering if it's the same recommendation or separate or whatever, but proceed.

So thank you very much, Dawn Cheng, on behalf of the Department of Land and Natural Resources. So right before this hearing, I did have a meeting with Mary Alice to discuss their proposed amendments and ours. I think we are comfortable with their proposed amendments because, as you suggest, this has broad implications to 205.

It is much more than just Lahaina. So we do support not excluding shoreline parcels as recommended by opsd.

I'm glad we got to two of you this morning. Okay. Okay. All right. Thank you.

Senator McKelvey.

Yes.

Okay. This W conflicts with the W in 1296 that we're trying to do just for Lahaina. This is a very sensitive subject.

A lot of the reasons why the community didn't want to invoke statewide laws is because this is going to set up a lot of controversy in a lot of different communities outside Lahaina, especially with expanding it even further in the definitions.

So I hope, as you work on this Bill, which I've got real reservations on, that there'll be a way to reconcile the W this in 1296 with section W that's in this Bill, because they're two different section W's now floating around in two different bills. Right. Eventually we have to reconcile them in some vehicle somewhere. But I.

There's a lot of concern and the reason why we put 1296 in is to avoid having Lahaina set off issues in other communities. Okay. So hopefully you can work with the Chair and others on trying to ensure that isn't the result.

Because they would hate to have Lahaina causing troubles for other communities insofar as these processes, which are of a sensitive nature. Right. Thank you, Chair. Appreciate you allowing me to distinguish the measure we passed already with our friends from housing.

Well, I'm glad, but I'm happy for this measure as well because this is statewide and we never know when another disaster is. And I don't want to see anything happens to future tsunamis on my island or anywhere else. But I think we addressed a lot.

We're going to have to reconcile the GW somewhere along the line.

Yeah. Okay.

Thank you for bringing that to my attention.

Okay. All right. Okay. So Ian's testimony would have been the same. Yeah. Okay. Durazo, you're on zoom. But I. Okay, same. Okay. All right. Okay. Maui County. Greg Post. I'm sorry.

Yes. Yes. Chair, Aloha. Chair, Vice Chair, Members of the Committee. My name is Gregory Post. I am represent the County of Maui and I just wanted to indicate that we stand on our written testimony that we submitted and of SB830. And I'm available for any questions you may have. Thank you very much.

Thank you for your testimony and bearing with us as well. Anyone else wishes to speak on SB830? We do have support from 20 folks. No opposition. And the rest of the testimonies? I can point out the groups in support. Lahaina Town Action Committee, Maui Chamber of Commerce, Pacific Rimland Inc. And Grassroots Institute of Hawaii.

Anyone else wishes to speak on SB 830? Okay. Hearing none. We're getting close to the DMs of. Hopefully that will make our times. SB 1331 relating to the Land Study Bureau soil rating system.

And this requires the Office of Planning and Sustainable Development in coordination with other agencies to update the soil data used in the Land Study Bureau soil rating system and create a mechanism for regular soil data updates. It appropriates Fund something long overdue. Up OPSD.

Thank you, Chair, Vice Chair and Members. With me today is Aaron Sidagawa. Aaron is a senior planner in the Office of Planning and Sustainable Development and he is the primary author of the land, the manager of the project for looking at how to update the soil rating System for the State of Hawaii State Agricultural District.

The study that Aaron oversaw looked at every soil rating system that applies to the State of Hawaii and came to the conclusion that the LSB study, because it's already embedded in law in Chapter 205, would be the right vehicle to update.

But it does need updating because it still relies on data from the 60s when there was sugar and pineapple and various plantation maintained infrastructure like irrigation systems that have fallen into disrepair and are no longer available to small farmers that dominate our agricultural industry today.

So what we're asking in this bill is to be able to take the results of that study and then update the LSB.

All right. Well, but he's located in your office, so. Yes, and thanks for working with the Department of Ag as well. But again, long overdue as I stated earlier. And now this study, I don't think. Did it have a dollar value on this measure?

Yes, we do.

400,000. Oh, okay. All right

Yes. Okay. And thank you for mentioning that. We worked with a very broad working group of stakeholders, you know, to come to this recommendation to the Legislature.

Thank you. Thank you so much. Good luck. Okay, Department of Ag for comments and in person DBID sends comments and support as well. University of Hawaii system and I believe sitar and why CTAR is testifying is that they have changed their name, taking out resources to sustainability if I know I remember.

However, it's just updating sitars, probably title Farm Bureau and by the way, ctahr, University of Hawaii supports the measure. Okay. Farm Bureau okay. In support. And Hawaii Farmers Union in support. We got no opposition. Anyone else wishes to speak to SB 1331? Okay, let's move on to the last item on the agenda.

SB 1334 and this is relating to integrated land use. It requires OPSD to conduct an integrated land use study for the use of lands within the agricultural districts. Establishes a full time planning position on this measure. Opsd.

Good afternoon, both of you. Good afternoon, Chair, Vice Chair and Members. With me today is Danielle Bass. She is our State Sustainability Coordinator and she has been the lead in working with our Deputy Director and other Members of dbid and also which include the Agricultural Development Corporation, the State Energy Office, hhfdc, HCDA and opsd.

We believe that this is a very needed study to look at finding the right balance for various uses in the state Ag District. The State ag district covers 46% of the state. The urban areas and state are very small. They were established in the 60s and have barely grown.

But what has happened is there are now a number of different uses that are permitted in the state ag district, but finding where to locate different uses so that we protect our most valuable ag lands but still have room for renewable energy and eventually housing as well. So I'm going to let Danielle take over from here.

Go ahead.

And most of the ag lands on my island anyway. Thanks for this, the work on this.

Yes, Chair, we've been also, we did read DOA's testimony as well as Hoy Farm Bureaus. We understand DOA's concerns and we of course will prioritize ag land and their uses especially. And we've worked with Hawaii Farm Bureau and support the comments that they've provided.

Okay. Another point as well is on any agriculture designation, you still have the IAL lands, and so you have to work with the counties on their General plans to see what has been dedicated as well. So very important with this measure. Now, I have a question, Members, if you'll allow me.

You're reporting to the Legislature, and I'm just wondering if it's too soon because your interim report is 2026 and your final report, 2027, you want to move up 2728, because you're not going to get any of the monies until later. So I think even the interim. I don't know if you're ready, Chair.

This is a separate study from the previous one, and we've been doing it without any resources.

So, Chair, if I may answer the question. This has been an ongoing administrative request from OPSD for the last three years. This is our third year with the collaboration of DBED's Deputy Director.

He has led initial pilot project specifically for the island of Oahu, in which we partner with our fellow DBED agencies as well as the Department of Ag and CTAHR to make this impromptu pilot study, if you will, of the agricultural lands available to Oahu. So we are underway.

Granted, we are working with the Legislature right now, so it is not our primary focus at this time. However, if we are provided staff, staffing and funding, we will be able to come in with an interim report of our productivity as well as in 2027, have a better report available statewide.

Zero, okay. So you're okay with your interim report next year? Yeah. Okay. All right. And thanks for dped, too, for helping out. Thank you. Okay. All right. Thank you. Dped. I mean, Department of Ag. Okay. Comments.

Department of Ag, Program of Agriculture center, written testimony with comments.

Okay. And working well with OPSD anyway, so we are told. Okay. All right. Okay. All right. Thank you, dbad.

Stands in strong support of this ops.

All right, thank you. Farm Bureau support. Testifying for Farmers Union in support as well. Anyone else wishing to speak to SB 1335? Okay. Anyone else? Going once, going twice. All right, this concludes the hearing portion of the Committee on Water and Land. We'll go into discussion, decision making before our next Joint Hearing with Department with the.

What Committee was that?

Health and Human Services.

Health and Human Services. Okay. All right. We got quorum. All right. Okay, here we go. I think I'm well prepared. So you guys are ready to zoom in as well? Okay. Committee on Water and Land is going into decision making on its agenda of Monday, February 10th with regards to SB561.

And this is relating to the conservation enforcement for Doe Care's recommendation is to pass this measure with amendments Just blanking out the appropriation portion, defecting the date to January 1, 2050 and recognize that there are technical amendments as well. Chairs any comments, Members hearing None. Vice Chair for the vote. Chair passing SB 561 recommendation with amendments.

Chair votes aye.

Chair's recommendations to pass SB561 with amendments. Chair votes aye. Vice Chair votes aye. Senator Chang. Senator McKelvey. Yes. Senator Decord.

Aye.

Madam Chair, recommendations adopted.

Thank you. SB 1456 relating to restoration of beachlands. Chair's recommendation this is an Administration Bill is to pass this measure as is. Any discussions hearing? None. Vice Chair for the vote.

Jericho Chair's recommendations to pass SB 1456 unamended of the five Members present on Waterland, Any no votes. Any votes or reservations hearing? None. Madam Chair, recommendations adopted.

Thank you. SB 1460 relating to updating public land leases. Another admin bill. Chair's recommendation is to pass this measure as is. Any discussions hearing None.

Vice Chair for the vote Charge recommendations to pass SB 1460 on amended of the five Members present any no votes or votes or reservations hearing None. Madam Chair. Recommendations adopted.

Thank you. SB 1517 relating to public lands. Chair's recommendation. I believe this is another Edmond Bill. Chair's recommendation is to pass this measure as is. Any discussions hearing None. Vice Chair for the vote Chair goes.

Charge recommendations to pass SB 1517 on amended of the five Members present any no votes or votes or reservations hearing None. Madam Chair, recommendations adopted.

Okay, thank you. SB 465 relating to Kiki Aola Small Boat Harbor. Chair's recommendation that we pass this measure as is. Any discussions hearing None. Vice Chair for the vote Chair goes.

Chair's recommendations to pass SB 465 unamended. Of the five Members present any no votes or votes or reservations? Hearing None. Madam Chair, recommendations adopted.

Thank you. SB 1511 relating to Hanalei Bay and I think. I believe this is an admin Bill. No, not okay. Hanalei Bay Chair's recommendation is to pass with the amendments and this would be just some technical amendments on this measure. Chair's recommendation then to pass with amendments. Any discussions? Hearing None. Vice Chair for the vote Chair go.

Side church recommendations to pass SB 1511 with amendments of the five Members present any no votes or votes or reservations? Hearing None. Madam Chair, recommendations adopted.

Okay. SB 1019 relating to Ocean Recreation Special Fund. Chair's recommendation is to defer this matter indefinitely. SB 1457 relating to Ocean user safety. This is the issue of the rulemaking for commercial and recreational use. Chair's recommendation on this measure is to defer this indefinitely as well. SB 565 relating to Pololu Valley Management.

Chair's recommendation is to pass this measure. We'll blank out the appropriation amount and that's pretty much it. Any discussions on SB 565? Hearing none. Vice Chair for the vote Chair goes.

Chair's recommendations to pass SB 565 with amendments of the five Members present any no votes or votes or reservations? Hearing None. Madam Chair, recommendations adopted.

Thank you. SB 1462 relating to the State Historic Preservation Income Tax Credit. Chair's recommendation is to move this administration's bill as is. Any discussions? Hearing None. Vice Chair for the vote Chair goes Aye.

Chair's recommendation Is to pass SB 1462 on amended of the five Members present any no votes or votes or reservations Hearing None. Madam Chair, recommendations adopted yes.

And the Chair would like to recognize that SB 1461 has been deleted from this measure today. SB 1602 relating to the Kehoe Aquifer system. Chair's recommendation is to pass this measure as is. Any discussions? Hearing None. Vice Chair for the vote Chair goes Aye.

Chair's recommendations to pass SB 1602 on amended of the five Members present any no votes or votes or reservations Hearing None. Madam Chair, recommendations adopted.

Okay. Thank you. SB830 relating to the coastal zone management, or CCM. As we are aware of this, Chair's recommendation is to pass with amendments offered by OPSD. Okay. Any discussions? Senator McElveen, I want to note the.

Conflicts between this and the other bill which was noted before. I also want to note that the Maui County Planning Department, by their own volition said that this was a controversial thing this bill is now doing and that I'm kind of bummed out, for lack of a better term.

That they would continue to push for this when the fact of the matter is they should just be expediting everything on their end. So I'm going with reservations, but appreciate your work.

Yes, thank you. Any further discussions on SB830 on CZM Chair's recommendation is to pass with the amendments. And we'll the amendments recognizes OPSD's amendments which is adding a new definition to appropriately insert it as subsection 2W if I'm correct, as stated in the testimony as well. Okay.

I just want to add though that the OPSD language in the 45 A22, which is now subsection W, OPSD thinks the language is sufficient and also already has the Governor's approval on this matter. Okay. So any discussions on SB 830 hearing none. Vice Chair for the vote pass with amendments.

Cheer goes I Chairs recommendations to pass SB 830 with amendments noting the reservations from Senator McKelvey. Any other reservations? Any no votes.

No vote.

No vote for Senator Decord. Madam Chair recommendations adopted.

Thank you. SB 1331 relating to the land study the on the soil rating system. A chair's recommendation on this Edmund Bill is to pass with amendments. We will be defecting the date to 01-01-2050 and to also note that to correct or make changes to CTAHR's new name as they are called today.

Same pronunciation but different words in ctahr. Okay. Having said that. Any comments Hearing None. Vice Chair for the vote Chair goes aye.

Chair's recommendations to pass SB 1331 with amendments of the five Members present. Any no votes or votes or reservations hearing Non Madam Chair recommendations adopted.

Okay, thank you. SB 1335 Chair's recommendation is to pass this measure just with some minor amendments that they may be technical amendments to the measure as it moves on as well. Any discussions Hearing None. Vice Chair for the vote Chair goes.

I charge recommendations to pass SB 1335 with amendments of the five Members present. Any no votes or votes or reservations hearing Non Madam Chair recommendations adopted.

Okay, we made it. All right. This concludes the Water and Land Committee on its February 10th Monday's agenda. And for those of you you pardon if you were here for the Committee the Joint Committee hearing we will proceed soon as the chair comes into room 225.

Good afternoon. Both of the committees on Water and Land and the Committee on Health and Human Services is on its agenda of February 10th. Today is Monday in room 229. Just some housekeeping measures. We ask that those testify on Zoom as well if you can stand on your written testimony.

If your oral testimony is different, the time limit for the testifiers will be two minutes as well. The hearing notice, copies of the bills and testimony can be found on the legislature's website. The video stream of this hearing can be found on the Senate's YouTube channel.

SB 1318 relating to water pollution. Amends Section 200-14 HRS to clarify that enforcement of criminal water pollution offenses remains under the jurisdiction, under the jurisdiction of the Department of Health rather than the Department of Land and Natural Resources. Attorney General. Good afternoon.

Good afternoon, Chairs and Vice Chairs.

Weren't you before at city and county?

I was

Long time ago. Okay. All right. Welcome.

Thank you.

And you were the pros..okay.

Members of the committee, Deputy Attorney General Mark Tom standing in for Trisha Nakamatsu. I understand there is kind of a time crunch in terms of another hearing. So I'll just let you know that this bill. We are in strong, Department's in strong support of this bill. Senate Bill 1318. It will provide consistency and clarity between two sections. Right?

By repealing this 200-14(c) and allows for consistency with 342D of the Hawaii Rights Statutes. I will be here for any questions. Thank you.

Thank you so much for being here. Department of Health, Environmental Health Administration, Communication in support. Is there anyone else wishes to speak to SB 1318, please come forward. Yes. DLNR. I'm sorry.

No, no, no, sorry. Dawn Chang. On behalf of the Department, we stand in support. And seminars and testimony. Thank you.

Thank you very much. This is admin bill as well, yeah. it's an administrations bill. Okay. All right. Thank you. Anyone else wishes to speak to SB 1318, come forward. State your name, please. Aloha.

Aloha Chairs, and Vice Chairs and Senators. My name is Kimmer Horsen.

Can you spell your last name, please.

Horse with an S, N. Sorry. I stand in support of this bill because the DLNR has failed with. What's his name? The one that was before her.

Previous qdministration.

The previous administration have failed to protect the environment and our Kia'i. Right. They got arrested on Mauna Kea. And I totally put that on you guys.

You know that our last leaders. It's not going to happen again. You know, we're going to protect the water, we're going to protect these resources. And there needs to be fines. We cannot trust the DLNR to oversee our environment. That's just all it, all it is.

And I think it was a $20,000 fine the Department of Health is proposing. So I support that. There needs to be penalties, and if it's going to drain people's pockets, that's the way we got to go. Mahalo.

Thank you. Anyone else wishes to speak to SB 1318? Hearing none, seeing none. Let's proceed then to SB 1459, relating to homeless encampments on Department of Land and Natural Resources lands. Appropriate funds to DLNR. DLNR.

Good afternoon, Chairs, Vice Chair. Dawn Chang on behalf of the Department of Land and Natural Resources. We stand in strong support and on our written testimony.

Thank you. And this is administering by vital care, is that correct? Okay. All right. Okay. Department of Human Services. Okay. Either the Director, communication in support. Is there anyone else wishes to speak to SB 1457? Going once, going twice. Oh, I'm sorry. 1459. Yes. Aloha.

Okay. My name is Kimmer Horsen, and I oppose this bill, SB 1459. Because the encampments in Waimānalo and Waianae, many are Native Hawaiian. Okay. Members of the Hawaiian Kingdom, they have a special status and they cannot be treated like foreigners and immigrants to Hawaii. There needs to be like a genealogy, find out who their families are.

If they have no family. They need health care. They need housing as well, but they need to be handled differently than any other. So I oppose this bill, and we shouldn't be criminalizing the houseless anyways. It's not pono, so. And the encamp, the kauhale. Kauhale. There's not enough on the, on the island for, there's not enough room. We all know that. So I don't know why we're going to be arresting them. Mahalo.

Mahalo. Anyone else wishes to speak to SB 1459? We'll proceed then. Yes. Yes. I'm sorry, Senator Fevella. Okay. Chair or...

Asking Pua Aiu, who's our homeless coordinator, to assist, Senator.

Also, do we need this bill to address the encampments that we have now going forward? Because are we lacking of funds to do this?

Yes, we are. So thank you for the question, Senator. In the past, we've done this jointly with Department of Transportation, and they put in funds. Starting this year, we won't have the DOT funds, so we need our own source of funds. We will continue to work in collaboration with DOT, but we won't have their funds available. So, yes, we do need this.

So of the previous speaker, when you guys are going to go over there and work on these encampments, and you know, the encampments I'm talking about. You guys not just going to go over there and arrest anybody? You guys gonna handle it with dignity and be pono about it, right?

Oh yes, of course, Senator.

Because I wouldn't support something like that. You know. You know, I know Waianae encampment to be closed, but I want it to be closed in a proper way. Not in a not pono way.

I appreciate your thoughtfulness in that, Senator.

And maybe you can reiterate again, this is just for the cleanup portion.

Yes. I mean we rarely do enforcement. We give notices and Pua can attest to that. But yes, it's really to permit us to clean up, help find the services, refer them to the right places, but it's rarely doing enforcement.

Understanding what the DOT transportation highways does statewide, that when the program started there were a lot of issues that we had to address with transportation and DOT's cleanup. And one of the issues that I think probably they did a good job with managing the storage. I understand that you cannot get rid of if you do cleanup. And this is what DOT highways used to do. They collect the whatever is left there, but anything that of value, including I guess IDs or whatever, they needed storage for claiming later. So can I ask you how you're going to do it?

So I'm going to refer to Pua because she actually handles that. Thank you.

So if we maintain our relationship with DOT, then their contractors will do it and they store it for 30 to 45 days. The law requires 30 days. And people can call their number and they meet up with them at a specified place to return their things to them. And we have a white paper on what we store and what we don't store.

Also, DOT will still be in play because you're going to contract with probably some of would be contract now.

The SPOs that done by the city also do the same. They give them a chance and they go over there. And that's the costly part that I know what DLNR and the city goes through because of sorting it out and storing it.

But it is a legal requirement. And, as you say, it's to treat them with dignity and recognize that for many of them these personal items may be the only thing they have. So we make sure we include those. Okay, thank you.

Thank you so much. Yes, questions? Senator DeCorte.

Thank you. There is a few DLNR properties that are identified here. Are these funds appropriated only to these DLNR lands or are they open up as well? It's not limited to these.

Those are just examples.

Okay, perfect. Thank you. Thank you, Chair.

Thank you. Anyone else wishes to speak to SB 1459? Hearing none. Okay, my partner here. This is your SB 438.

Okay, I'm gonna recess because I need to call the other one to recess that one, and I will be back here for the rest of this. Okay, thank you. All right, so we're gonna ask for a recess for two minutes or so.

Calling a 105 calendar. Health, Waterland, and Health and Human Services, instead of going into SB438, I believe Waterland is ready for decision-making for the first two SDs. So with that, Senator Inouye.

All right, thank you. And for those of you for 438, please bear with us. We'll be right with you. Okay, we got quorum. Waterland. Okay. Chair's recommendation on SB1318 and this is relating to the water pollution. Chair's recommendation is to pass this measure as is. Okay. Any discussion? Hearing none. Vice Chair for the vote for the Committee on Water and Land, Chair goes aye.

Chair's recommendations to pass SB1318 on amended. Chair votes aye. Vice Chair votes aye. Senator Chang. Senator McKelvey is excused. Senator DeCorte. Madam Chair, recommendations adopted.

So for Health and Human Services, same recommendation passed as is Chair votes aye. Vice Chair for the vote.

Okay. Chair votes aye. Vice Chair votes aye. Senator Hashimoto is excused. Senator Keohokalole is excused. Senator Fevella.

Aye.

Recognition is adopted, Chair.

Okay, thank you. SB1459 relating to the homeless encampments on DLNR lands. Chair's recommendation is to pass just with few amendments. We're blanking out the dollar value and defecting the date to January 1st, 2050. Any discussions? Hearing none, Vice Chair for the vote for the Committee on Water and Land. Chair goes aye.

Judge recommendations to pass SB1459 with amendment, noting the excusal of Senator McKelvey of the four members present. Any no votes or votes or reservations? Hearing none. Madam Chair, recommendations adopted.

Okay. For Health and Human Services, same recommendation passed with amendment. Vice Chair for the vote.

Okay, thank you very much. Noting the excuse absence of Senator Keohokalole. Any reservations? Any nos. Recognition is adopted, Chair.

Okay, so continuing on. Next up is SB 438 relating to waste disposal facilities. First up, we have Mayor Bissen in opposition. Next we have Department of Health providing comments. Okay. Next we have DLNR, Ryan Kanakaʻole providing comments. Next we have City and County of Honolulu providing comments.

Aloha Chair, Chair San Buenaventura, Roger Babcock Director of Department of Environmental Services for City and County of Honoloulu. We've submitted comments and we stand by those comments and we will remain here for any questions.

Okay, thank you very much. Next we have, excuse me. Ernie Lau, Board of Water Supply in support.

We stand on our testimony in strong support.

Thank you very much. Next we have County of Hawaii, Department of Environmental Management in opposition. Craig Kawaguchi, Sierra Club of Hawaii, in support. Sierra Club, Wayne Tanaka, are you present on zoom? No?

Not present on Zoom, Chair.

Okay. Earth Justice Network, Mike Ewall providing comments on Zoom. Mike Ewall, are you present? Please proceed.

Yes, I am present. Okay, thank you. My name is Mike Ewall with Energy Justice Network. There's a lot of concern about a new landfill in Wahiawa. And why is it dangerous? Because a double line landfill full of H-POWER trash incinerator ash can still ultimately leak chemicals into the aquifer.

If that is a concern, we ask that you adopt the amendment that we proposed in our testimony, as have others, that would also preclude building roads with this ash all across the island, including over the aquifer with no liner systems, where it can do even more damage to the aquifer and others who drive on it, who build the roads, and are exposed in other ways.

There was a resolution adopted by the Democratic Party of Hawaii last year in support of this very idea and the language and Senate Bill 538 echoes the same. We ask you to amend that into this bill, please.

Thank you very much. IBEW Local 1260 in support, Kika Bukoski. I don't see him. Okay, next. Climate Protectors Hawai‘i. I see Ted Bohlen here in support.

I'll stand on written testimony also including amendment.

Thank you very much. I saw that. Environmental Caucus of the Democratic Party of Hawaii, in support. Melodie Aduja, are you present on zoom?

I am. Aloha. Aloha, Chairs. Okay, thank you. Thank you. Contaminants from waste disposal facilities can leach into the groundwater and surface water, posing serious health risk to the community. SB 438 helps to prevent such contamination, ensuring safe and clean drinking water for all residents.

By prohibiting waste disposal facilities near aquifers and agricultural land, SB 438 promotes conservation and natural resources and the protection of ecosystems. This b ill supports sustainable land use practices by prioritizing the protection of water resources and agricultural land over the placement of waste disposal facilities.

Ensuring the waste disposal facilities are located away from critical water resources and agricultural areas contribute to the overall well being and quality of life for Hawaii residents.

We support also the incorporation of language from SB 538, which requires municipal solid waste combustion ash to be disposed of only in lined landfills and prohibits the reuse of municipal solid waste incinerator ash for uses such as road building fill or construction. This ensured safe disposal.

Melodie, we need you to wrap up. And I know that there's a timer there, but that's wrong. So please.

Oh. Oh, okay. Okay. Well.

We have your written testimony, which you're reading anyway.

Well, I'm reading part of it, but yeah, basically we don't want to have any ash that would go into the landfill. And it has to in a hazmat landfill. Okay, thank you. Thank you very much, Chair.

Thank you. Next we have Green Party Hawaiian in support, Free Access Coalition in support, HECA Solid Waste Task Force providing comments, Hawaii Farm Bureau in support, Kupuna for the Moopuna in support, Faith Action for Community Equity in support. Jamie Simic, are you present on Zoom? Jamie?

Not present on Zoom, Chair.

Okay, we have 25 other individuals in support. One in opposition, two individuals providing comments. Anybody else wishing testifying? SB 438, come on up. You have one minute. Let's see what happens.

We will. I am in support of this bill. I don't know why. Kimmer Horsen. I don't know why the west side is like labeled the place for waste and landfills. Like build this, put this in. You know what, put it in the state capitol right here. You know, PFAS and chemicals in your guys water.

Okay, quit putting it on native Hawaiian lands and crown lands and get some of these developers out of here. Golf courses, football stadiums, all that stuff is unnecessary. It's not needed. We're not even going to have an Oahu anymore because we keep polluting our water tables. Mauna Kea, Red Hill, Kapukahi. It's very serious.

Thank you. It is.

Why you cutting me off? It's so rude. I'm not done. It just makes me want to stay longer. Don't do that. And she wanted to talk more. You have a minute to let her talk longer. It's very rude. You guys are a guest here. You're not even, you're not even Hawaiian Kingdom subjects.

Okay, thank you very much. Okay. Thank you very much. Okay, next up, anybody else we can testify in SB 438? Seeing none. Members, any questions?

Chair, just to make sure that we hasten our vote as well. But I'd like to make a suggestion. As requested in some of the testifiers, let's take in Ted Bohlen's recommendation. The amendment that, that's ensuring that the toxic incinerator ash is properly placed in a landfill and not used on roads over aquifers where the public can come into contact with. So as recommended in three other. Yes. So I'd like to suggest that if you'd consider that as well.

Any, any questions? Okay. Seeing none. Any other questions? Okay. For decision making for SB 438, Chair's recommendation is to pass with amendments. We are going to add a definition of significant aquifer as a freshwater aquifer with potential as a drinking water source.

We're going to also accept Climate Protector's proposed amendments, which wasn't only Ted Bohlen's, but also as well as Democratic Party of Hawaii. So we're going to accept that those proposed amendments regarding the ash, the lining of the ash, and basically he points it out on his, on his comments. And we're also going to add a defective date.

So that way the conversation keeps continuing. Okay. Any comments, questions, concerns? Seeing none, pass with amendments. Vice Chair for the vote.

[ROLL CALL]

Okay. For the Committee on Water and Land, Chair's recommendation on SB 438 to pass with amendments. Any discussions for the committee? Hearing none. Vice Chair for the vote on Committee on Water and Land, SB 438 with amendments. Chair votes aye.

[ROLL CALL]

Thank you.

Thank you. And with that, we are adjourned.