Senate Standing Committee on Labor and Technology

Okay. Good afternoon. Committee on Labor and Technology. We have a 3:10pm agenda. It's Wednesday, February 5th. We're in Conference Room 224, Hawaii State Capitol. This meeting is being streamed live on YouTube. The unlikely event that we have to abruptly end this hearing due to technical difficulties.

The Committee will reconvene to discuss any outstanding business on Friday, February 10th at 3:00pm in this Room 224. And there will be a two minute testifiers limit. Oh, sorry. Monday, February 10th in Room 224. Okay, thank you very much. Okay, up first you have Senate Bill 183, relating to EUTF Benefits Trust Fund.

Allows impasses and disputes related to the amounts of state and county contributions to the EUTF Trust Fund to be resolved by arbitration. Okay, up first... Okay, we have B&F Director. Okay, thank you very much. Okay, up next we have DHRD Director. Okay, thank you very much, Director. Up next we have United Public Workers.

Aloha, Chair. Kamakana Kaimuloa, Government Affairs Manager, United Public Workers. You have a written testimony in strong support. We just want to note that, you know, just because something is within the scope of negotiations doesn't mean it's actually negotiated. Thank you.

Okay, thank you very much. Okay, up next we have HGEA.

Aloha, Chair. Nui Sebast here with HGEA. We stand in strong support of this measure. You have our written testimony. But I do want to emphasize that the current negotiating negotiation process for employee employee share of EUTF contributions lacks a dispute mechanism, effectively making this item of negotiation one sided, employer controlled. What we're really looking to do is to allow public sector unions to proceed to impasse with respect to this negotiation item, which we deem as a fair way to address this item. Mahalo. I'm happy to answer any questions. Thank you.

Okay, thank you very much. Okay, up next we have Christian Fern of UPA also in support. Any others wishing to testify? Okay, seeing none. Members, questions? Okay, no questions. Let's move on to the next measure, Senate Bill 185. Okay. Relating to indebtedness to the state. Okay, up first we have DAGS Comptroller Services.

We stand on our written testimony in support. Our accounting administrator is here.

Okay, thank you very much. Okay, up next we have the United Public Workers.

Chair, Senator. Senator Moriwaki. Again, Kamakana Kaimuloa, UPW. You have our testimony support. You know, I think this is more... What's being proposed is more in step with the rising cost of living in Hawaii. And it's a lot more fair, particularly for our members who make, you know, less than $2,000 per pay period. Happy to answer any questions. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Up next we have HGEA.

Hello, Chair, Senator. Nui Sebast with HGEA. We'll stand on our written testimony in strong support of this measure. I do want to emphasize that, you know, this measure is really aimed at of the lower end, lower earning employees and stuff. So happy to answer any questions. Mahalo.

Okay, thank you very much. Okay. I believe that's the only testimony we received. Any others wish you to testify? Senate Bill 185. Okay. Seeing none. Any questions? Senator Moriwaki.

For DAGS. So I'm sure you've seen the testimony from the unions about the lower end employees not really, it's really impacting them. And I understand that all your stuff is automated, but is there any way to accommodate that need and have you folks discussed anything that can help these employees?

Sure. In terms of the system, as it stands, yes. It can be programmed to accommodate the different tiers and the fixed amounts as proposed in the bill. The only program downside to that, if you can classify it as a downside, is that it will prolong the recovery period and the resources that will be dedicated to auditing and staying on top of the recoveries would be needed.

Or can it be, I know you have the tiered system that you have automated, but is there a way that, at least in terms of, I don't know, your HR people talking with the employees that have that need so that you can accommodate those who are on the low end of the spectrum in terms of salaries so that we don't impact them as the union is saying.

Right. So with the current process, it's a decision between the employer and the employee within the guidelines as provided for currently. So, so if they, that's the option for them to use their leave balance, if they have that, to lessen the impact on the recovery.

So the other part of the bill that says notifying them in 60 days, can you guys do that so that they get notifications so they're aware of it and whether the departments can talk with these employees? Is that something that the departments know about and they can I guess make some kind of pay installment plan or something like that?

Right. The discussion as to what's workable for them, that is in place right now. The 60 days, it depends on when the final audit kicks in. So it may not be right away after the pay period. There may be a certain amount of time for the Department to finish the final audit.

But this is from the time of determination, so that would be at the time of the final audit. Right. And then you can do it within the 60 days as it's being amended in this bill?

My understanding is that's probably doable.

But the tiered approach that's in this bill you say is doable as well?

That's also my understanding. It can be programmed, but the more tiers that you have and the lesser the amount, you are going to now lengthen the recovery period.

But the tiers that are suggested in this, there's like three. That's doable?

Right. And currently they're two.

Oh, two. So you're adding one. Just one more tier?

So if you're adding the tiers and you're reducing the amount of the recovery, it will, it will lengthen the time.

So is there any way that you can see amending this amendment to accommodate at least the payback, but also also the impact on those that are at the lower tier of the pay schedule?

Current... The current statute works right now. So if the intent is to lessen the impact on people who may be having difficulty by lengthening and prolonging, then that would be the intent of the bill. But the impact on operations and our ability to recover would now take a longer time.

But you can change the system to do that. Thank you, Chair.

So again, just to clarify, the amendments that's proposed in the bill is doable by DAGS?

It can be programmed. Yeah, it can be programmed.

Okay, thank you very much.

Okay, thank you. Okay. Moving on to Senate Bill 458 relating to employment. This amends the definition of employer in state law that governs payment of wages and other compensation to include the state and counties when a provision in that law has no comparable provision in state law that governs public officers and employees.

Thank you.

Okay, up first we have Department of Labor Industrial Relations Director. Good afternoon. Director.

Good afternoon. Chair Aquino. Senator Moriwaki. I'm Gene Butai, Director of the Department of Labor Industrial Relations. We stand on our testimony providing comments and thank you for the opportunity to testify.

Okay, thank you very much. Up Next, we have DAG's Comptroller, Deputy Comptroller. Okay, thank you very much. Up next, we have Andrew Kawano testifying for sitting County of Honolulu. Also in opposition, Hawaii State Teachers Association.

Aloha Chair and Vice Chair. My name is Sarah Milianta- Laffin, and on behalf of the Hawaii State Teachers Association, we were excited to support this bill because at the beginning of this school year, over 300 teachers actually didn't get paid on time and they didn't have much financial Recourse.

And one of the things we noticed these were all brand new teachers who didn't know policy, didn't know their rights. Often a lot of charter school teachers as well. So this caused huge financial hardship.

This bill would prevent situations from happening again, ensuring the state and county employers are held to the same standards as private employers with respect to timely payment of wages. So this is really important to teachers. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Any others wishing to Testify? Senate Bill 458. Okay. Seeing none. Members questions?

Yeah. Okay. DAGs Again.

I have accounting administrator Nadia Nash.

So you're responsible for the payment of the wages for the DOE as well as the Executive branch. Can you explain why the 300 teachers as HTSTA testifies, were not timely paid?

I think that has to do with the charter schools, the way that they were not put into the system by. The Charter School Commission.

HSTA can come back up because. Come on. So.

Aloha again, Sarah Milianta-Laffin for the Hawaii Teachers Association. Oh, I'm fine. It's not. It's okay. I don't know where to go. I'm really okay. I'm really okay. Thank you. So originally we thought it was just charter school teachers until we started serving our members.

And I can say I have an art teacher at my school who's a regular public school art teacher who was also a new hire who was not paid. They were given a $2,000 like a loan. So a $2,000 loan. But then they were required the next month to pay it back even though they hadn't been paid.

Several of these teachers missed rent payment, missed car payments. It was quite a hardship. It was hard for us to figure out because of record keeping issues who it affected. So it was, it deeply affected our members and that's why we're here today.

So DAGS you have any, you know, because this seems. Is it a one time only or is it going to happen again? Because we changed a lot on the definition of employer. It affects a lot of different agencies as well. So just want to know how that happened because 300 is a lot of people.

My understanding is that our accounting central payroll processes payment, but the processing of the payment will not happen unless the data is in the system. So that the data from the DOE side, my understanding, correct me if I'm wrong, is different from the regular Executive Branch where we are all part of the system.

So from the data interface, if the data is not in there, then there is nothing that's generated from central payroll.

Each Department has their payroll Processing. So we have to get that information from each department's payroll zip section in order to process it.

Is anybody from DOE here?

Okay, thank you. I can share that. We were told that it was something to do with retirements, that the person who knew how to code the charter school payments had retired and the new Clerk hadn't been onboarded.

There was something with that when we had kind of inquired, but it took us a long time to get that word and get it fixed from DOE as well.

Hmm.

So I don't know. It's. It's tough because it's with one and DOE runs its own, you know, so that's hard to impact all other departments because of the DOE failure to get the information in on time to DAGs. Okay, can you work with DOE to make them do timely submissions, especially on payroll?

We do have payroll deadlines that they're supposed to adhere to, but we can't make them.

Send them a nasty letter.

I think it was a resource problem on that side. The person who knew how to do whatever she needed to do wasn't there. So as a result, the data wasn't imported into our system.

Okay, well, if you can talk to doe, because I'm sure the teachers would appreciate it to not have that happen again.

Yeah, they did reach out for us to see what we can do, and we expedited the processing and we. We did do an additional payroll run for those teachers.

Okay, thank you.

Chair, I have a quick question. So have there been any other incidents where this Bill would, you know, positively impact what had happened? I mean, have there been any other situations where this has happened besides what had happened with the teachers and the 300 impact? Have there been any other situations like this?

Not that we are aware of, but go ahead.

Thank you. This is actually, if I'm correct, the second year in a row this has happened to our new teachers and our charter school teachers. With the start of the year, they weren't paid on time. And the way our paychecks work, a lot of teachers spend a lot of money to set up their classrooms.

And that that first paycheck in August is really, really desperately needed. And so we didn't expect, after having to talk to Haido, that it would happen again. And so two years in a row, this has happened. Okay, thank you very much. Okay, thank you.

Chair, if I may, because you referenced to this particular Bill, this Bill, by exempting the state and the county from the definition of employer, has its own set of problems. There are fiscal implications and operational implications as detailed in our testimony.

Thank you very much.

Moving on to the next measure, Senate Bill 425, relating to qualified community rehabilitation programs. Clarifies that the civil service exemption for personal service contracts for building, custodial, and grounds maintenance services with qualified community rehabilitation programs shall not cost more than 850,000 in the aggregate per private person or entity, regardless of the number of contracts or qualified community rehab program utilized for the personal service. Okay, up first we have HGEA. Thank you very much. The Hawaii State AFL-CIO in support. United Public Workers.

Aloha, Chair, Members. Again, Kamakana Kaimuloa, United Public Workers. You have our written testimony in strong support of this bill. We support this bill because it tries to address a growing problem with employers leaning heavily on these contracts. What they're doing essentially is parcelling these contracts so that...

So that in the aggregate it actually exceeds the threshold that's in statute. In our testimony, we do provide an example with Maui County DPR, Department of Parks and Recreation. But what we're starting to see because of staffing shortages is that other employer jurisdictions are also utilizing these contracts and exceeding the statutory threshold.

The interpretation by the employer is that it's on a one per contract basis, but we argue that it's actually in the aggregate. This is just seeking clarification and hopefully that we are able to resolve this dispute with the employer. Happy to answer any questions you may have. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Okay. Any others wishing to testify? Senate Bill 425. Seeing none. Members, questions? I have a quick question for UPW. So have there been incidents, as I think your testimony is alluding to, that there's been maybe some level of abuse regarding this, this particular cap? Is there anything that you'd like to clarify specifically?

So going back to our testimony, the example we provide, you know, we provide some numbers that with specific to Maui County Department of Parks and Recreation. They're essentially dividing up the contracts by park district. Right. Rather than across the department as a whole. So when they do that, they're actually exceeding $850,000. That's what we're alluding to with the abuse. But we're also seeing this type of interpretation being exercised in Hawaii County as well, UH Hilo as well as now DOT airports. So.

Okay. All right, thank you very much. Okay. Any other questions? Let's move on to the next measure. Senate Bill 1287 relating to transparency. Okay.

Requires that the state's unfair and deceptive practices law, food, beverage and service establishments that accept tips and employ tipped employees to pull signs that Include certain language explaining their tip allocation practices and the contact information for the Wage Standards Division of the DLIR and the Wage and Hours Division of the U.S. Department of Labor.

Okay, up first we have DLIR Director.

Aloha Chair and Senator Moriwaki. Gene Butai for DLIR. We stand on our testimony offering comments. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Okay, up next we have the Attorney General Department.

Good afternoon. Deputy Attorney General Christopher Han with comments on the bill. We're just recommending that a savings clause be inserted to address the risk of retroactive applications since that's prohibited under the exposed fact of clause of the US Constitution. Thank you.

Okay, thank you very much. Any others wishing to testify? Senate Bill 1287. Okay, seeing none. Members, questions? Okay, seeing none. Let's move on to the next measure. Senate Bill 1660, related to employment. Requires employers in the hospitality industry to implement anti-harassment measures, provide training, and equip certain workers with panic buttons.

Prohibits retaliation against a hospitality worker who files a complaint, uses the provided panic button, or participates in an investigation or proceeding related to a harassment complaint. Requires the LIR to adopt rules, including rules determining penalties and establishing procedures for handling complaints. Requires all hospitality employers to comply no later than January 1, 2026. Okay, up first we have Hawaii State Commission on the Status of Women.

Hi, yes, I'm here.

Hi, good afternoon.

Hi, Chair, Senator. Llasmin Chaine, Executive Director, Hawaii State Commission on the Status of Women. I stand on my written testimony, and I'm available for questions if you have any. Thank you.

Okay, thank you very much. Any others wishing to testify? Senate Bill 1660. Oh, DLIR Director.

Thank you, Chair and Senator Moriwaki. Hawaii Civil Rights Commission didn't submit testimony, you know, because they will be meeting next week to take a position on SB 1660. There is already a well established system for filing and investigation of these types of complaints with the Hawaii Civil Rights Commission. It should be noted that, you know, they have consistently supported legislative efforts to increase employment protections for our workers. Thank you.

Thank you very much, Director. Any others wishing to testify?

Good afternoon. Michael Golojuch Jr, President of Private Work Hawaii. He, him pronouns. We stand in strong support of this bill. Anything that will protect our workers, especially in the current climates as we see the hostilities going up, we need to make sure that harassment and discrimination has no place here in Hawaii and that we, our workers are protected. So we encourage you to pass this out. Mahalo.

Thank you very much. Any other species to testify? Senate Bill 1660. Okay, seeing non Members. Any questions? Okay, seeing none. Moving on to the Last measure on the agenda, Senate Bill 631. Okay. Relating to the Department of Human Resources Development. Okay. First we have Director Hashimoto. Thank you very much, Director. Up next, we have Koi Vu. Okay.

Karen, Luke, Ellen Awai, Jodi Akao, all in support. And we do have late testimony from a Tammy. Okay. Also in support. Any others wishing to testify. Senate Bill 631. Okay, I see none. Any questions? Okay, I see none. We're gonna take a recess to wait for quorum Recess. Okay. Thank you very much. Reconvening our 3:10 p.m. agenda.

Decision making is as follows. First bill, Senate Bill 183, relating to the Hawaii EUTF Trust Fund Members. The recommendation is to move this as a Senate draft, one we do understand the concerns provided by the administration, but I'd like to keep this going for further discussion.

So the recommendation is to move this as a Senate draft, one with a defective date of July 1, 2050.

Any questions or concerns, colleagues? Vice Chair for the vote, voting on Senate Bill 183. Recommendations to pass with amendments. [Roll Call]

Chair, the recommendations adopted. Okay, thank you very much, colleagues.

Moving on to Senate Bill 185. Okay, we're going to indebtedness to the state Members. I'd like to keep this going as well. Okay. For the discussion. It seems that DAGS is able to do some of the things that are in the bill currently, so I'd like to keep this going for further discussion.

So, recommendation is to move this as a Senate draft, one with a defective date of July 1, 2050.

Questions or comments? Seeing none. Vice Chair for the vote, voting on Senate Bill 185. Recommendation to pass with amendments, noting all Members present. Are there any reservations or nos? Seeing none. The recommendations adopted.

Thank you very much. Moving on to Senate Bill 458. Okay. Relating to employment. This would amend the definition of employer and state law that governs payment of wages and other compensation to include the state and colonies when a provision in that law has no comparable provision in state law that governs public officers and employees.

So for this one Members, we do understand the concerns that have come up the last two years, specifically with the Department of Education. But it seems it is an isolated case with that particular Department. Department.

So what we're going to do is we're going to work administratively with the Department to ensure that these types of things don't occur in future, future events. So having said that, because of the potential impact on other other operations in state government. We'll be deferring this measure based on those recent questions or concerns.

Members, let's move on to the next measure. We're going to defer again, Senate Bill 458. Moving on to Senate Bill 425 relating to qualified community rehabilitation programs. Members, the recommendation is to move this as a Senate draft one.

Okay, we're going to have add some technical amendments for the purposes of clarity and consistency and a defective date of July 1, 2050. Any questions or concerns, colleagues? Seeing none. Vice Chair.

Voting on Senate Bill 425, recommendation is to pass with amendments noting all Members present. Are there any reservations or nos? Seeing none. The recommendations adopted.

Thank you very much, colleagues. Moving on to Senate Bill 1287, Religion to Transparency. This is the Vice Chair special. I'd like to keep going for further discussion. So, Members, the recommendation is to move this as a Senate draft one.

We're going to add the AG's recommendations on page 4, line 20 to add a new section or subsection to protect the bill against any potential retroactive application issues.

Okay.

And we're also going to add some technical amendments and the defective date of July 1, 2050. Any questions or concerns? Seeing none. Vice Chair for the vote.

Voting on Senate Bill 1287. The recommendation is to pass with amendments seeing all Members present. Are there any reservations or no's? If not, recommendations adopted.

Okay, thank you very much. Moving on to Senate Bill 1660 relating to employment. We understand it's been brought up very eloquently by Department of Labor and Entertainment in Industrial Relations. However, I'd like to keep this measure moving as well for further discussion.

So, Members, the recommendation is to move this as a Senate draft one with some technical amendments and a defective date of July 1, 2050.

And we also will also be adding the Hawaii State Commission of the Status of Women and some of their amendments specifically on page three, line 14, to amend the language to as follows, subsection B, sexual assault victim rights, local sexual violence survivor services, statewide providers and their corresponding.

24/7 sex assault hotline phone numbers and subsection C, the proper use and limitations of the panic button provided under paragraph 3. In addition to that, the Second Amendment would be on page 4, line 66 to 11, to amend language as follows under subsection C to add statewide sexual assault survivor service providers and their corresponding.

24/7 sex assault hotline phone numbers. And also we'll be amending language on page four, lines 12 to 15 to basically let the employers determine which languages would be included for translation and for support services. Also some technical amendments and a Defective date of July 1, 2050.

Any questions or concerns, colleagues? Seeing none. Vice Chair for the vote. Voting on Senate Bill 1660. The recommendation is to pass with amendments noting all Members present. Are there any reservations or no? Seeing none. Share the recommendations adopted.

Okay, thank you very much, colleagues. And onto the very last measure, Senate Bill 631, relating to the Department of Human Resources Development. Members, we're gonna recommend deferral at this point in time.

I believe we did pass a certain bill last year that provides other departments the ability to screen and select applicants for their specific proof from initial screen. So any questions or concerns, Members? Okay, so Deferring Senate Bill 631. That concludes our agenda. Thank you very much.