House Standing Committee on Water & Land

Good morning. We are opening waterline committee. I'm Vice chair Dee Morikawa. To my right is Chair Hashem. We are in, Room 411.

Today is Tuesday, April 7, 10:00AM agenda. Some rules that we need to go through: there'll be a two minute time limit, and that's because we have to get this hearing over before session. And for those on Zoom, please keep yourself muted and your video off while waiting to testify. And after your testimony is complete, turn it off. If you're disconnected, you may attempt to rejoin.

The Department of Agriculture and Biosecurity stands on its written testimony offering comments.

In the event of network network failure, it may be necessary to reschedule. Please avoid using any trademark copyrighted images if you using a Zoom background, and please refrain from profanity or uncivil behavior. So with that, let us open up with SB 2405 SD1 HD2 related to agriculture workforce policy. And first up, we have department of ag and biosecurity. Thank you.

Next is HHFDC, Dean Minakami.

Good afternoon, chair, vice chair, members. HHFDC stands on his testimony in support.

Thank you. We have do we have anyone on Zoom?

Sure. No.

Okay. Hunter Haviland. Hey, Havenlin.

Morning, chair, vice chair, Hunter Haviland with Hawaii Farmers Union. We'll send out our written testimony in support of this measure as a important opportunity to bring together key partners to address the need for, agricultural workforce housing. Mahalo for the opportunity to testify.

Thank you. Is there anyone else? No. That's all we have registered to be here in person. We have numerous, agencies and per, people in support.

Is there anyone else here that wants to testify on this measure? Seeing no one else. Members, are there any questions? No questions? Okay.

Let's move on. We're gonna do wrestle h HCR 19 and HR 20, designating the month of March as March for water month in Hawaii. And we have in person, plumbers and, feathers Hika. Thank you, Hika. That's all the people I have registered to testify.

Is there anyone else that wants to testify on this measure? Seeing no one else. Questions, members?

No?

No questions? Let's move on. Now we're moving too fast. Okay. We are at HCR 63, HR 57, bridging DLNR and DOT to determine clearly defined jurisdiction responsibility for Honopu for Honopu Bridge.

First up, DOT. No. Maybe you're going too fast on that. Okay. DOT is in support, but they're they're not here.

Is there anyone else wanting to testify on this? Okay. Members, any questions or nobody? Okay. Thank you.

Let's move on to HCR 85, HR 77. Again, urging BLNR to transfer parcels that make up the East Kapolei transit TOD project. K. First up, we have

DOT.

DOT.

They're not here and nobody answered.

We're done with that one. We have OPSD, but they're not here. They support it. DLNR, Lauren or our designee? Testimony.

OPSD is here too.

Oh, okay. Okay. Thanks for being here.

We stand on our written testimony with comments.

Oh, yes. I see it. Thank you. We have, HHFDC, Dean Milakami.

We stand on our testimony in support.

Thank you. We also have, HCDA.

Morning. Stand on our written testimony in support.

Thank you. Anyone else wanting to testify on this measure? Anyone on Zoom? Okay. Thank you, members.

Any questions? Really? Wow. Very good. Okay.

Let's move on to HCI 140, HR 132, urging state agencies that own or control land in West Maui to implement and enforce aggressive vegetation management, fuel reduction, and so forth. We have first DLNR. It's Lauren. Am I on the wrong one? Sorry.

Let's move on. HHFDC. Oh, there. Wait. Dean first.

Dean Milakami.

We send our testimony in support and offering comments.

Thank you, Dean.

Let's see. Now we have Michael Walker on Zoom. Is that you? No? Not here?

Oh, okay. I see you. Hi.

Aloha, vice chair, chair, members of the committee. My name is Michael Walker. I serve as the statewide fire protection forester for DLNR Forestry and Wildlife. The department has submitted a testimony with comments. And available to answer any questions you may have.

Mahalo.

Thank you. We also have Dean, you you did. Okay. Is there anyone else here wanting to testify on these measures? Members, any questions?

Thank you for breaking it. Give me some time to catch up. Go ahead.

Mister Minakami, I understand your testimony and the scope of what's being asked of you. This is just a resolution. Would you be able to, if this resolution passes to kind of formulate and come up with some kind of, budget or scope of how this affects you so that we

It depends on, you know, what is being required of us. We own about 200 acres of land in Lahaina area. So since the fires were expanded firebreaks, 50 foot firebreaks along all areas that border urbanized area and just maintain the firebreaks. It's quite expensive. It's over a $100,000 just for that.

So if we have to go and clear land for the full 400 acres, that would be very expensive. We'd have to look at what's required and what are the options to, you know, accomplish that objective.

Would you be able to, kind of like, define that and have that in your back pocket, if and when this comes up for the legislature to task you with that and, you know, you can ask for appropriate funds related to that. Okay. Thank you.

Thank you, chair.

Any other questions? Okay. Seeing none, let's move on to HCRs 166, HR 156 requesting DLNR to identify state lands on East Oahu suitable for planting of native Hawaiian trees. First up, we have I don't know if they're present, but they're in support.

I don't show anyone else being present in person. No. Zoom. Okay. We have numerous individuals and organizations in support.

Is there anyone else you might to testify on this? If you can't remember, I don't think you can ask any questions. Let's move on. HCR 82 HR 74, requesting the State Building Code Council to develop and adopt adopt basic shelter standards to enable low cost rapid deployment housing solutions. First up, we have, Hawaii State Council on Developmental Disabilities.

Aloha, chair, vice chair, committee members. My name is Chase Silver. I'm with the Hawaii State Council on Developmental Disabilities. We apologize for missing this on the first round. The intent of our, requested amendments is just to allow for these homes to be accessible.

It would be good if it could be on the front end because oftentimes these types of homes, the accessibility has to be on the back end. You know, we're talking things like a three or four inch, like, little curved step to get into the home. If an individual is in a wheelchair, that can be prohibited in ways people don't really think about, which is they can't leave or get in the home on their own, which then cause logistical issues.

So we're just the intent was just to think about that as we build this. Thank you so much.

Thank you. That's all the people I have registered to testify. Anybody on Zoom know? Anybody else here in the room would like to testify? Yes.

Kika, go ahead. 8274. Yeah.

K. I I apologize. You

should No.

I do have Okay. Sorry. Go ahead.

Yeah. Chair, respectfully, we stand on our written testimony in opposition and just wanted to, you know, I guess, clarify our our opposition primarily is, you know, as we see this resolution, although we know it doesn't have the full, effect of law, it it does, indicate the intent of the legislature and it asks the state building code council to do certain things. Our concern is that it takes what is emergent intended to be emergency shelters, temporary emergency shelters, and it creates a pathway to make them permanent.

And our our concern is is that in in many cases, these temporary shelters are substandard, and they're not according to, state, and local building code standards. And and we have further concerns that, the, you know, the intent the underlying intent of this legislation is to house the less fortunate.

Unfortunately, we believe that this could have long term negative implications and create long term codependencies and relegate the less fortunate to living in substandard homes. And for those reasons, chair, we ask that you please defer this measure. Thank you.

Thank you, Kiko. Anyone else trying to testify? Okay. Have a question. Go ahead.

Question, chair. Thank you for, plumbers and fitters. I mean, so we've dealt with, environmental climate crises, and we've had shelters put up. Has that happened? Have he has it happened that, these temporary structures have been made permanent in a way that excludes where there are no plumbers and fitters who are then used to make it permanent?

Well, I I think Lahaina is a perfect example. I think part of the purpose for this and other legislation that have been introduced in this session is to make permanent something that was intended to be temporary. I I I think the, the resolution itself references appendix p of the California building code. And the distinct difference between appendix p and the California building code is that it it pertains specifically to temporary shelters.

The difference is this actually takes it a step further and provides a pathway to make those temporary shelters, emergency shelters permanent.

And that that is a distinct difference between what, they reference in the California code versus what we're trying to, request to be done here. And again, our concern is that it it could lead to long term impacts to those that are less fortunate to disabled, the the elderly, and the low income. It would relegate them to substandard housing conditions because they have nowhere else to go.

Okay. But if you say they have nowhere else to go, then are you saying that the the the consequence that the alternative would be houselessness?

I think we should build homes for these for this population that are two standard that are that are the same for everybody else. Your your your position in life shouldn't dictate whether you live in a less safe or a more safe house. That that's that's our position. And we've been pretty consistent for the last several years. Okay.

Yeah. Okay. Thank you.

Thanks.

Kika, with hang on. State building code council. Am I able to determine that these units are housing these houses can be converted to permanent habitation with your what you're suggesting.

No. I I actually, I think in the in the resolution itself, it references, HUD standards and, other, FEMA standards, including international codes that for off-site construction that don't necessarily, in our opinion, meet the minimum standards that are adopted here in the state of Hawaii. So it so, you know, in our opinion, it it it it provides a pathway to allow substandard homes to be made permanent. And I think that defeats the whole purpose of having minimum building codes and standards. You might have single wall construction.

You might use one one by three versus two by four, which makes structures less resilient. You know, in our testimony, we we reference I mean, we're on the heels of several disasters, and we always talk about resiliency. This actually creates less resilient homes.

I'm hearing you. I understand. I mean, our portion of what we deal with here in this committee is the emergency part of it, which, you know, we we would support having these types of houses be constructed. But on a permanent basis and the safety of it would fall under probably the housing.

So this actually allows for these emergency you know, I mean, you know, emergency, rapid deployment homes can be done through executive proclamation, which was done several times already.

So I don't see the the the the need for this, but I think the intent of this is to create a pathway for those temporary homes to become permanent. And that's what we have issue with. We we shouldn't be, perpetuating substandard homes for the less fortunate because that's who's gonna end up living in them. And we're gonna create secondary hazards, especially in times of of of, disasters and and whatnot.

Yeah.

I I agree. And thank you for submitting your your testimony because you bring that to our attention. Yeah.

I can follow-up to your line of questioning. You mentioned resiliency. So what we saw with the flooding happened on the North Shore, and people's homes who those homes may have been built to code as permanent structures. Right? And the cost to replace those homes, for instance, are gonna be really high, and some of those costs won't even be covered.

So when we talk about resiliency, isn't it easier to bounce back and build a single wall construction temporary home, that is already designed to I mean, since the since the building building homes to code don't survive certain natural or man made, disasters anyway, the resil I feel like we lose resiliency because everything is so overbuilt that it's so expensive to get insurance to rebuild. It takes longer, and so it takes longer to get people rehoused. I don't know. There's this I don't know. It I think You know what I mean?

You're, it assumes that all the homes were actually built to code. And it could have been grandfathered in at a different time when maybe we didn't have the current codes and standards.

Chair, could I have ask a question?

Thank you for your testimony. Thank you for being here. I kind of have the same line of questioning.

Go ahead. Please, please.

I guess for me, the the keyword is the definition temporary. And, and obviously this is, not meant for permanent, although Aye, I respect, the previous testifiers, concerns. So what what would you foresee or imagine as being a maximum duration of, quote, temporary?

Well, so I don't I don't know if we're the right agency to ask for that because we're kinda looking specifically at the accessibility standpoint. I mean, the one thing I can't speak to is that there's often and I think the last test part said the same thing. There's often different flexibility in code for temporary housing and then not so much when you go into permanent housing. So lots of standard shift. And I think the resolution tries to account for that a little bit.

Right. I have to ask somebody a question. I think that's your quota.

You're trying to hit your quota for today.

I thought that was a legitimate question. And that was the only person that I thought might have some of that comment on.

Okay. Any other questions?

I have a question. Please go ahead. Do you wanna add on to your

Yeah. I just wanna say we're not opposed to finding alternative housing options. What we're we're we we're actually working on doing just that that meet minimum codes and standards, and we feel are, safe to occupy according to today's standards. So we're not saying we're opposed to alternative options. We're just saying that these options aren't, up to up to par.

We we believe there are options out there that can provide rapid deployment, lower cost, more efficient homes, that do meet local codes and standards. And we're working on that right now. Recently, Bill, Maui County passed Bill 15, which addresses some of the concerns in Lahaina for fighting those types of homes that are locally constructed, locally built, locally inspected according to local codes and standards that we feel meet these criteria. And that's why we feel that these types of resolutions are not necessarily needed.

Do you mean prefab homes?

Prefabricated, specifically modular. These the the what these are proposing are manufactured homes that largely come from outside of state. Modular homes are built in state according to local building codes and standards and can be rapidly deployed in emergency situations.

Alright. Any other questions?

Maybe I can okay.

Oh, sorry.

That's alright. Teamwork. Teamwork. No problem. Okay.

Let's move on, members. We are now on HCR 98 and HR 90. Requesting the Department of Planning and Permitting of the City and County of Honolulu to develop a county wide housing pattern book to streamline permanent approvals and reduce regulatory barriers. K. First oh, man.

I lost my place. Department of Housing and Land Management, City Council comments. Didn't say they're be gonna be here, but Grassroots, are you here? And nobody on Zoom? Nope.

Okay then. No one's asked questions now. Let's move on. Okay. We are now on HCR 104, HR 96, urging the Department of Transportation and the Department of Transportation Services of the City and County of Honolulu to work with community groups to advance the system of coastal trails on the North Shore Of Oahu.

And DOT on Zoom. Are they on Zoom? Oh, okay. Not present. Let's move on to Kalehano, North Shore Community Land Trust. No?

Okay. Anyone here wanting to testify on this? Seeing no one. Members, let's move on. HCR 106, HR 98, endorsing Waikiki as a rural surfing reserve.

Okay. Do we have University of Hawaii? Denise Conan Dean. I think not on Zoom. Not present.

Rick Egg Eggett by Kikibee Special Improvement District Association in support. No. Is there anyone else in the room wanting to testify on this? Okay. Seeing nobody else, members, move on.

Okay. HCR 141, HR 133, urging the county of Maui to enforce the provisions of the fire code of the county of Maui. Okay. Is there

Two individuals.

I have a bunch of individuals who are in support, but anyone in the room wanted to set testify on this. On Zoom? So Okay. Let's go on to our last wrestle at HCR 165, HR 155 requesting the city and county Honolulu, Department of Parks and Rec, to install permanent pickleball net and court lighting at the tennis courts at Camilo Ikiye Community Park. Okay.

First up, we have on Zoom. Do we have a new meeting, Mel? Mel Ona?

Yes. Hello. Aloha, Chair Hashem, vice chair Morikawa, and members of the committee.

My name is Doctor. Mel Ona and I'm a resident of East Honolulu and I'm here in strong support of HDR 155, HR 155. This resolution builds on meaningful progress already made. Two weeks ago on March 25, the city council adopted resolution 26-045, which approved the installation of three permanent pickleball nets at Kamiluiki Community Park, representing half of the six dedicated courts. And since then, we've already seen how powerful the space can become.

Pickleball has brought together people of all ages, Keiki, working adults, Kupuna, and a shared environment of activity, connection, and joy. However, without lighting, access remains limited, especially for those who work during the day and can only participate in the evenings. As a physician, I see this as more than recreation. It's preventive health. It promotes physical activity, reduces isolation and strengthens the social fabric of our community.

So adding permanent lighting will unlock the full potential of the park and ensure it serves our community safely and effectively. I respectfully urge your strong support of HCR 165, HR 155. Mahalo for your time and for your commitment to our community. Mahalo

Thank you. That's all I have registered to be a person on Zoom. Anyone else wanting to testify on this measure? Are there any questions, members? Okay.

No questions. We shall recess. Okay. We are convening our 10AM agenda for Fatherland decision making. K, members.

Bear with me. I'm gonna go this or and maybe not for it, obviously. Hang on.

I take a question.

Okay. We're voting on SB 2405 SD1 HD2 relating to agriculture reports housing. The bill is already blanked for appropriation and has a defective date. So we're gonna I recommend that we pass this as is. Members, any comments, questions?

Please take your vote.

Chair, I just chair.

Oh, yes. Go ahead.

I'm gonna be voting my reservations just to consider the department's concerns regarding cost and staffing.

Thank you. Anybody else? Okay.

Okay. Members who are voting on SB 2405 SD1 HD2. Chair's recommendation is to pass unamended. Chair and vice chair vote aye. Belatti?

Ichiyama.

Aye.

Aye.

Reservation.

PoePoe?

Aye.

Woodson is excused. Shimizu?

Thank you. Souza?

Aye.

Chair, your recommendation is adopted.

Thank you. Thank you, members. Next up is HCR 19, HD1, HR20, HD1, designating the month of March as March for Water Month in Hawaii. Our recommendation is to pass this as is. Any comments, questions?

Seeing none, please take the vote.

Okay. Members are voting on HCR 19 HD1 and HR 20 concurrently. Chair's recommendation is to pass this unamended. The chair and vice chair vote aye. Noting the member that presence of all members except for Woodson.

Are there any reservations or no? Seeing none, chair your recommendation is adopted.

Thank you, members. Voting on HCR I'm sorry. We are now on HCR 63 HD1, HR 57 HD1. This is urging the Department of Land and Natural Resources and DOT to determine and clearly define your exceptional responsibility for one of the pool bridge. My recommendation is on this is to pass as is.

Members, any comments or questions? Seeing none, please take the vote.

Members, we're voting on HCR 63 HD1 and HR 57 HD1 concurrently. Chair's recommendation is to pass unamended. Knowing the presence of all members except for Woodson, is there any reservations or no? Seeing none, Chair, the recommendation is adopted.

Thank you. HCR 85 HD1, HR 77 HD1, urging DLNR to transfer parcels that make up the East Kapolei TOD project. My recommendation for this is to pass as is. Okay. Any comments?

Okay. See none.

Okay. Members, we're voting on HCR 85 HD1 and HR 77 HD1. Chair's recommendation is to pass unamended. Are there any reservations or no's? Seeing none, chair your recommendation is adopted.

Thank you, members. For HCR 140 HD1, HR 132 HD1, This urgent state agency is the owner control land in West Maui to implement and enforce aggressive vegetation management. My recommendation is to pass as is. Any comments, questions?

Chair, reservations just to consider HHFDC's concern regarding funding and staffing. Thank you.

Any other comments? Okay. Chair, please.

Okay. Members, we're voting on H HCR 140 HD1 and HR 132 HD1. Chair's recommendation is to pass unamended. The reservations for Shimizu. Is there any other reservations or no's?

Seeing none, chair your recommendations are adopted.

Thank you, members. For HCR 166, HR 156, requesting that Department of Land and Natural Resources to identify state lands in East Oahu suitable for planting of native Hawaiian trees. We will do some amendments for technical, non substantive, and that, needed for clarity, consistency, and style. That's it. Any comments, questions?

Okay. Vice chair for the vote.

Okay. Members, we're voting on HCR 166 and HR 156 concurrently. Chair's recommendation is to pass with amendments. Are there any reservations or no? Seeing none, chair your recommendation is adopted.

Thank you, members. Okay. For HCR 82 HD1, HR 74 HD1, my recommendation is to pass this as no. No. I'm sorry.

We're gonna no. We're gonna do some, an amendment because what we wanna do is to make sure that if these homes become permanent, they need to be upgraded to Hawaii code or the HUD code. And we will also put in the committee report that they should consider the State Council and Developmental Disabilities a concern about making these housing, accessible. Members, any comments, questions? Okay.

Thank you.

Okay. Members who are voting on HCR 82 HD1 and HR 74 HD1. Concurrently, chair's recommendation is to pass with amendments, noting the excused absence Woodson. Are there any reservations or no's? Seeing none, chair, your recommendation is adopted.

Thank you, members. For HCR 98 HD1, HR 90 HD1, I rec requesting to file a plan and permitting on the city and county to of Honolulu to develop countywide housing pattern book to streamline permit approval. My recommendation is to pass this as is. Any comments, questions? Seeing none.

Please take the vote.

Okay. Members, we're voting on HCR 98 HD1 and HR 90 HD1. Chair's recommendation is to pass unamended. Noting the excused absence of Woodson. Are there any reservations or no?

Seeing none, chair your recommendation is adopted.

Thank you. For HCR 104, HR 96, urging the DOT and the Department of Transportation Services of the City And County Of Honolulu to work with community groups to advance the system of coastal trails. On the North Coast, my recommendation is to pass this one as is. Any comments or questions? Seeing none, please state your vote.

K. Members are voting on HCR 104 and HR 96. Chair's recommendation is to pass unamended. Noting the excused absence of Woodson. Reservations or no's?

Chair, your recommendation is adopted.

Thank you. For HCR 106, HR 98, endorsing Waikiki as a world surfing reserve. My recommendation to pass as is. Any comments? No.

Okay.

Okay. Members, we're voting on HCR 106 and HR 98. Then the chair's recommendation is to pass on the amendment. Noting the excuse absence of Winston. Is there any reservations or no's?

Seeing none.

Thank you, members. We are now on HCR 141, HR 133, urging the county of Maui to enforce the provisions of the fire code. My recommendation for this one is to pass as is. Any comments?

Seeing none.

Okay.

The members are voting on HCR 141 and HR 133. Chair's recommendation is to pass unamended. And excuse the absence of Woodson. Are there any reservations or no? Seeing none, chair, your recommendation is adopted.

Hang on, members.

Okay. HCR19. Sorry, numbers. HCR19, we voted for March 14. HCR.

Oh, HR20 HD1 instead of HR20. K?

K.

K. Correct. Okay. We are on the last. HCR165 HR155.

Requesting City and County of Honolulu, Department of Parks and Rec to install permanent pickleball nets and court lighting at tennis courts at Kamilohiki Community Park. My recommendation is to pass this as is. Any comments or questions? Seeing none.

Members, we're voting on HCR 165 and HR 155. Chair's recommendation is to pass unamended, seeing the excused absence of Woodson. So any reservations or no? Seeing none, Chair, your recommendation is adopted.

Thank you, members. No further business. We are adjourned.