House Standing Committee on Judiciary & Hawaiian Affairs

Welcome everyone to the House Committee on Judiciary and Hawaiian Affairs. It It is Thursday, April 2, 2PM here in Conference Room 325. My name is David Tarnas, head chair of the committee. And we've got our wonderful vice chair, representing PointPoint, and our in veteran member, represent Shimizu. Other members will be here presently.

And there's a former Judiciary Chair, Kate Stanley. Thanks. Good to see you, Kate. If you're testifying on Zoom, a couple things. Keep your camera and mic off until you testify, and then turn it on so we can hear and see you.

And then turn it off again, please. If you have questions, talk to our IT. Just use your chat function. They'll do their best to answer you. You get cut off.

Don't panic. Join when you can. We'll try to let you back in to testify finish your testimony. Please don't use any trademark images or copyrighted images. It causes problems with that livestream.

If you're testifying on Zoom or here in person, if you could keep your testimony to two minutes, I'm gonna be really strict with that today because we're gonna lose quorum at a certain point, and I I need to get through all these bills to do decision making. And, you know, let's all get along. So it's okay to disagree, but let's not be disagreeable. K. Starting up, Senate Bill 2169 Senate Draft One, House Draft One relating to the Agribusiness Development Corporation.

I'm not gonna be reading all the the details. You can all read it on the hearing notice. And members who are are public that is watching, please look at the hearing notice so you can read the summary of the bill because I'm not gonna be reading the summary in today's hearing so we can get through it and before we lose quorum. Okay. Senate bill 2169 Senate draft one house draft one relating to the Agribusiness Development Corporation.

First up, we have the Office of Hawaiian Affairs. Welcome.

Aloha Mai Kakou with the Office of Hawaiian Affairs. OHA stands on our written testimony offering comments on SB2169. OHA supports policies that strengthen agricultural productivity, Hawaii's food security, and economic self sufficiency for locally based farmers. But at the same time, protection of the public trust land corpus is a core trust duty OHA owes to its beneficiaries.

OHA supports the amendments made in the last committee to exempt public trust lands defined in HRS 17171-2 from the proposed condemnation powers. It is critical that this exemption remains in place to protect public trust lands from improper disposition and potential alienation.

Sounds good. Got the message. Mayor Bisson, County of Maui on Zoom or his representative? Not present with comments. Deputy Director.

Deputy Director from Maui, please join us. Welcome.

Hi. My name is Priya Landgraf. I'm on the call on behalf of Deputy Landgraf for Department of Water Supply. He's having a hard time logging in, but I have him on speaker. This is him.

By our written testimony.

Okay. Thank you. Might be a different bill. Sorry. Just a moment.

Elena Bryant, Earthjustice on Zoom. Please proceed, miss Bryant.

Aloha, Chair Tarnas, Vice Chair Poepoe, and Committee Members. My name is Elena Bryant testifying on behalf of Earthjustice in strong opposition to senate bill two one six nine. Through our advocacy on behalf of community groups in West Kauai, Earthjustice has experienced firsthand ADC's mismanagement of public lands and water systems and the real harm that mismanagement causes to local communities.

This bill would grant ADC the extraordinary power of eminent domain while also shielding the lands it acquires from being repurposed for other public uses without its consent. No agency with ADC's track record should be entrusted with that kind of unchecked authority.

For decades, ADC has failed to responsibly manage the public resources already under its control. In West Kauai, for example, ADC leased thousands of acres of land to GMO seed companies that relied heavily on restricted use pesticides. The result was contamination of ag land for local sustainable agriculture and contamination of groundwater streams and nearshore reefs, harming both the environment and the surrounding communities.

Despite a federal court order requiring ADC to come into compliance with the Clean Water Act, ADC has yet to secure and comply with the terms of a discharge permit, nor have they instituted any best management practices or temporary solutions to reduce pollution discharge into West Kauai's coastline while the permit is pending. At the same time, ADC has effectively ceded control of public lands and water infrastructure to private entities, causing years of delay in restoring stream flows required under a state water commission order. Basic repairs and reporting requirements

that the commission also ordered reporting requirements that the commission also ordered ADC and its licensee to complete immediately are still not done ten years later. That's not stewardship. This is an abdication of responsibility. ADC lacks the staffing and resources to manage its current portfolio. Expanding its authority to acquire additional lands and water systems will only magnify these failures, particularly in communities like West Maui, where active community based management of water resources is critical to wildfire recovery efforts.

Just a few years ago, this legislature considered dissolving ADC altogether. It would be a serious mistake to now grant it even broader powers over our public trust resources. For these reasons, Earthjustice respectfully urges this committee to defer Senate Bill 2169. Mahalo for the opportunity to testify. I'm available if there's any questions.

Thank you very much. Appreciate your good work. Anyone else wishing to testify on Senate Bill 2169? If not, questions, members?

Is ADC here? Nope. That's too bad. Sure.

Anyone else? Thanks. Let's move on to the next measure. Senate Bill 2818. Senate Draft Two, House draft one relating to boating.

Clarify oh, I'm not this this, clarifies penalties for violations of voting and ocean recreation laws pursuant to Chapter 200. First up, DLNR, division of boating and ocean recreation. Welcome. First time I get to see you this session. It's been a while.

Yeah. For DLNR, we will stand on our testimony in strong support.

Why do you like this bill?

So a previous law had decriminalized a number of voting violations. We determined that some of

the severe violations were inadvertently decriminalized. So this bill will fix that by making sure that the severe and egregious types of violations have appropriate penalties.

So you've been selected about the ones that you're including in here.

Okay. Thank you. Attorney General? In person. Hey.

Yes.

Good afternoon, chair, vice chair, members of the committee. Elise Oyama from the Department of the Attorney General. Our we sent in support of this measure. As Todd had mentioned, it does help to clarify penalties, for offenses that we haven't been able to prosecute. So we sent in support.

Thank you.

Great. Thank you very much. Is there anyone else wishing to testify on Senate bill 2818? If not, questions, numbers? If not, thank you very much.

Let's move on to the next measure, Senate Bill 2972, Senate Draft 1, House Draft 1, relating to Oahu coral reef restoration. This requires DLNR to begin the whole marine initiative process no later than 07/01/2026 on Oahu. First up, we have Department of Land and Natural Resources. Not present.

Please review their testimony, members. Next, we have Ted Bohlen-Azul. Not present. You can review his testimony too.

Next, Frederick Smith on Zoom. Please proceed, Mr. Smith.

Yes. Hello. My name is Frederick Smith. I live in the Kalkakua Bua Nkona. A graduate student at Hilo focused on marine science and policy.

I respectfully oppose SB 2972, SD 1, HD 1. Earlier versions of this bill took a meaningful step by restricting nighttime spearhead fishing abuhu and kala on Oahu as a temporary interim protection until Ho'amua Marine Initiative rulemaking is completed. The HD 1 removes those protections and instead requires only that DAR initiate the Ho'amua process for Oahu now, which is not equivalent to actual on the water management and risks undermining DAR's existing timeline.

Uhu and Kala are critical herbivorous fish that help control algae and support coral reef resilience. If the legislature intends to address peer-reviewed evidence of declining herbivore biomass or reef degradation on Oahu, it should maintain real interim protections rather than replace them with a mistimed procedural directive.

I respectfully ask the committee to reject the HD 1 version and restore the prior SD 1 version. Thank you.

Thank you very much, Mr. Smith. Anyone else wishing to testify on this measure? Yes, please. Come on up and introduce yourself.

Aloha, Chair Tarnas, Vice Chair Poepoe, and members of the committee. My name is Hannah Lizeak, and I'm testifying on behalf of the Ocean Legislative Task Force.

We have received your testimony. I just didn't know you'd be here personally.

No worries. Thank you. While we do support the intent of this measure, we respectfully ask that the committee restore the original version of this bill, which would temporarily prohibit the taking by spearing of uhu and kala at nighttime, in state marine waters around Oahu. The Holomua Marine Initiative is a community-driven effort that's currently taking place with the goal of developing island-based marine management strategies and recommendations, and while we wait for those recommendations, it's crucial that we maintain the populations of uhu and kala.

These two fish populations play a critical role in our coral ecosystems, and larger uhu, in particular, contribute to sand production, beach formation, and coastal stability. Our task force represents over 160 individuals across over 20 organizations, and I wanna thank you for the opportunity to testify and for consideration of our recommendations on this measure. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Anyone else wishing to testify? If not, Mr. Bohlen, please go ahead.

Okay. Thank you. Chair, vice chair, members of the committee, Ted Bohlen for Hawaii Reef and Ocean Coalition. Also in support of the intent of this legislation but urging the committee to go back to the original version of the bill. The reefs are really bad shape in Oahu.

We need the herbivores to clean the reefs, and we need that to occur now and not several years from now when we might have new rules at the end of a whole new process. I generally support whole new process, and I think I know of the chair's support for working with DO, DAR, letting them do their thing and not trying to legislate what should happen from the legislative side.

But I think this is an exception to that rule, and I've urged the committee to adopt the original version of the bill because I think it is more—actually better aligned with Ho'amua to have protections now for this emergency situation with the lack of reef protection in Oahu. So, please, please amend the bill back to the original version and pass it from the committee. Thank you very much for the opportunity to testify.

Thank you, Mr. Bohlen. Anyone else wishing to testify in this measure? If not, questions, members? If not, thank you very much. Let's move on to the next measure.

Senate Bill 2—2398—Senate Draft 2, House Draft 1, relating to residential housing utilities. This has to do with Boards of Water Supply publicly disclosing on their website service connection availability for residential permitting and construction. First up, we have Board of Water Supply. Mr. Lau, you're a very famous guy. Thanks for spending time with us.

It is a great honor to be here.

I'm not wearing boots, please.

Yeah. That make it very deep. Chair and vice chair and members, Ernie Lau, manager for the Board of Water Supply. We oppose the current version of the bill, but we looked at it very closely, and assuming that it'll only take one hour to evaluate each residential parcel, we have about a 145,000 residential zone parcels going on Oahu. It would take about 74, 73, 74 years. I'd have to add about 80 staff to my organization.

Oh, you got a solution?

But my solution, which we have a, a good discussion with the Chair of the Housing Committee. The solution is actually something that we can achieve without additional staff requirements or additional costs, which is basically a map that would show our service area, and then, specified deadlines for responding to a complete application or inquiry for water service. Let that be good for ninety days. So, our recommendations, which is attached to our testimony, is something we can work with and can support.

Appreciate your help in figuring out a good path forward.

Yeah. Thank you. Thank you for all the patience of this community.

Yes. Absolutely. Thank you very much, Mr. Lau. Okay, next person said they wish to testify is McKinley Eads with Avalon Development Company.

Please proceed.

Hello. McKinley Eads on behalf of Avalon Development. We're in strong support of this bill. We've seen how first—we've seen firsthand how uncertainty around water availability creates unnecessary risk, delay, and expense, and too often, projects move through early planning only to discover infrastructure constraints that were not publicly visible at the outset, resulting in wasted time, sunk costs, and in some cases, lost housing opportunities.

But we appreciate the Board of Water Supply of Honolulu's comments. They already provide strong water availability tools, and this level of transparency is not consistently available on the neighbor islands. We believe this bill helps close the gap through statewide baseline information while preserving utility discretion and operational authority. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Anyone else wishing to testify in this measure? If not, questions, members?

Question, Chair.

Yep, Rep. Shimizu.

Board of Water. Mr. Lau, thank you for being here. Thank you for all your speech. I wasn't clear on your testimony because previously, as I've been following this, Board of Water has opposed this bill. I'm, I'm seeing your late testimony and from your verbal expression, you're saying that you're okay with it now?

With the amendments.

We're, we're not okay with the bill as it currently stands in the HD 1 version. We suggest actually kinda replacing completely with our recommended changes, which is on page two of our testimony, because the.

So, you'd be okay if we adopt your amendments?

Yes. If you don't adopt amendments and keep the, what's provided in the HD 1, then we have serious concerns because of the impact on staff time, positions, and costs.

Okay. Thank you for clarifying that. Thank you.

Vice chair?

So, I understand the amendments would make it better for the Honolulu Board of Water Supply. Is there any insight into the other boards of water supply and their ability to meet?

I, I, I believe and I wanna be careful. I don't wanna speak for the other water managers or directors, but I believe Kauai is okay with these proposed changes. Hawaii Island is—they already have a map up that provides information. So, I think they're not gonna testify on this and Maui, I'm not sure where Maui stands, but.

If they didn't submit testimony, they are aware of what we recommended, in terms of the changes, and I didn't hear any strong objections.

Thank you.

Thank you. Appreciate it. Any other questions? If not, let's move on to the next measure. Thanks very much, Mr. Lau.

Senate Bill 2046 Senate Draft Two, House Draft One relating to underground storage tanks. It requires the owner operator of the storage tanks to with a confirmed release, to meet certain standards for the restoration of the environment. On this measure, first up, Office of Hawaiian Affairs.

Aloha, my colleague, Ini Loa Borden with the office of Hawaiian Affairs. OHA stands on our written testimony offering comments on SB2046. The catastrophic November 2021 Red Hill fuel leak demonstrated the devastating consequences of regulatory failures that have allowed numerous fuel leaks to threaten Oahu's precious sole source aquifer.

OHA is concerned by amendments that removed language that required the cleanup and removal of jet fuel to levels below the detection limits of the best and most sensitive technology and methods available with the goal of complete remediation, as well as the removal of rebuttable presumption language that compromises timely cleanup of fuel leaks.

Surrendering a commitment to restore our precious, irreplaceable value is an unacceptable compromise that shirks the state's duty to protect as a public trust resource and uphold the principle of that reflects our kuleana to future generations.

All have respectfully asks, request this committee to incorporate the the, amendments we detail in our testimonies in the column.

Thank you very much. Department of Health.

Good afternoon Chair, Vice Chair and Members of the Committee. My name is Noa Klein. I'm a planner in the Solid and Hazardous Waste Branch in the Department of Health's Environmental Management Division. I'm just gonna

summarize our testimony. We have testimony. We appreciate the intent of this measure to protect human health and the environment. We really appreciate that intent. That's what we do all day every day.

We feel this measure is not necessary and we're asking for it to be held. The reason it's not necessary is because the department already has the authorities and the rules that we need to require

investigation and confirmation of releases from USTs, underground storage tank systems. Also, all of the authorities and rules that we need to require cleanup to levels that are designed to protect human health and the environment. We have risk based levels in our rules and we also have the authority to require that a specific owner operator go further if there are circumstances where we feel that's not enough to protect human health and the environment.

These are the same authorities that we use to order the defueling and closure of Red Hill. Since there's already a confirmed release at Red Hill and the Navy is proceeding with site investigation to determine the extent of the contamination and is already proceeding with cleanup.

They've worked on some pilot projects, testing remediation technologies. The current rules and authorities that the Department of Health has are being used to oversee this effectively. So there wouldn't be a value add. One more point I wanna make is that total petroleum hydrocarbons or t TPH middle distillates, which is the range where jet fuel falls, the tier one screening levels in our rules are very close to what the standard method is reliably able to detect.

And when you're looking at extremely low levels, that method is just detecting hydrocarbon molecules.

It cannot actually distinguish at low levels where those are coming from, whether they're coming from petroleum or for something that's natural in the environment such as algae or plant waxes. So even though the method is called total petroleum hydrocarbons, that's not what it's really measuring. It is designed for cleanup sites and for situations where you're expecting to see a large amount of petroleum in the environment. So that on the gas chromatography, you have a spike that is characteristic of a particular product.

When you have very low levels, that's not possible.

You don't see that characteristic spike and you cannot tell what those hydrocarbons are coming from. So in summary, we feel this measure does not really add to the effectiveness of existing laws and regulations. Those laws and regulations are working and the proposed changes only create confusion about those authorities. It would also require rulemaking action by the department that would take resources away from all of our shared goal, which is to protect human health and the environment and to clean up our Red Hill.

Thank you very much for your time.

I'm available for questions.

Thank you very much for your good work, Mr. Lau. Board of Water Supply.

Thank you, Chair and Vice Chair and Members. I appreciate the work of the health department in in trying to protect our human health and our environment. However, I disagree in this matter. I believe that the current HD one version should be replaced with the original SB2046. We we stand with OHA on this and others in protection of our water resources.

Mahalo.

Thank you very much. And just to clear, DOH is opposed to it also. They they they don't they they say the bill is unnecessary.

Oh, we asked for the restoration of the

You wanted you want the original bill. I got that. Sherry Pollack 350 Hawaii on Zoom.

Aloha. Can you hear me?

We hear you. Please proceed.

Yes.

Aloha Chair, Vice Chair, Members of the Committee. My name is Sherry Pollack, and I'm with 350 Hawaii. We stand on our written testimony with comments on this measure. Hawaii's drinking water supply is already at risk because of climate change. All the more reason to ensure we take great care in protecting our aquifer, keeping it safe for current and future generations.

We welcome legislation that will lead to the complete and full remediation of our aquifer. But the current version of this measure seriously weakens the intent of this critical legislation. We urge the committee to amend SB 2,046 back to its original form. We strongly encourage the committee to consider Board of Water Supply Manager and Chief Engineer Ernie Lau's testimony. The staff at BWS are the experts and they know how to protect our precious water.

If there's one lesson we all should have learned by now, it's to listen to Ernie. I also strongly urge the committee

to review the testimony of Red Hill fuel tank advisory committee member, Doctor. Melanie Lau, which further explains the problems with this measure in its current form, making it toothless and useless. Mahalo.

Thanks very much, miss Pollock. Dave Mullenix, Greenpeace on Zoom. Not present. Not present. Next, Wayne Tanaka.

Not present. Not present. Anyone else wishing to testify in this measure? If not, questions, Members?

Question, Chair.

Yes. Rep Shimizu. Department of Health, please.

Thank you for your good work. You know, I I'm looking at your testimony and some of your concerns, I believe,

were addressed in a Senate, amendment, Senate Draft One, where they amended and they took out those lines that, you referenced in your testimony that you had concerns with.

So if that's in place, then you would be okay with the bill as it stands right now?

Well, our position has changed a little bit over time. You've probably noticed. That's because we've been looking at it more closely and thinking through the possible consequences. So we we kinda said, oh, you know, this would be okay. And then everyone else is saying that's because it doesn't do anything.

We don't need it to do anything. What this bill would do right now is tell the Department of Health to do a rulemaking and to put specific language into our rules. But the language we already have in our rules is what we need. It's already there. And so rulemaking, you know, takes a lot of time and effort, and it will take staff time away from actually overseeing the cleanup at Red Hill.

So those of us who would actually have to do that work of a rulemaking got more involved in the testimony. I've been working on these rules. I've authored every update to the underground storage tank rule since 2018. So I'm the one who would need to do this update. And talking with our deputy attorney general who has also been working on these rules for a very long time, we're like, yeah, we could put this specific language in, but what would that get us?

And the answer is really nothing because we have the authority already. We have risk based cleanup levels and then we have a clause that's like, if for any reason the Department of Health thinks that this is not enough to protect human health and the environment, we can order something specific to a site. Okay.

Thank you. Can can I ask one more question? Sure.

On portable water supply, Mister Lau. You know, I feel like I'm in the middle of this and I, I hear the DOH's position sounds very reasonable. Of course, I wanna respect what you say so. Why is their position not enough for for the bar water supply?

For for example, the, the the term on the bill I mean, what they do right now is they use the reliable methods that provide reliable results. But it doesn't mean that's that's gonna be the most sensitive results, which is actually lower than that. Because the most reliable ends up being like, an averaging of the results. So the laboratory can reliably produce the result the test result.

And so the bill is actually asking us to look look at below that, to look at the most sensitive levels that they can actually detect.

And and the other part too is it assures that the cleanup is, you know, complete and clean as restoration as much as possible to pre contamination conditions. Right now, on the risk space, you know, the risk space levels doesn't mean that there won't be any petroleum left in the environment in our water resources. And this tries to take it down to the lowest possible level that can be detected.

Okay. Sorry. One one last question to DOH. I'm not testing your patience, but, DOH, what was just stated regarding a lower detection, would that require new equipment or besides the new rules that you gotta write up, just practically, logistically, what what does that look like for DOH?

So there are other methods that you can do besides the standard gas chromatography. They call it forensic methods to try to determine, like, what where what is the source of this hydrocarbon. Sometimes you can figure it out, but not always. So introducing language that just says kind of the best practicable, it doesn't it doesn't actually actually get us anywhere that we're not. Like, right now, we are at the best practicable level, in terms of the available technology.

So the the challenges that we have at Red Hill and at any UST cleanup site are not about our authorities or our rules. They're challenges about the specific complex geology and hydrogeology and the real practicalities of what's possible. So the idea that we can clean up to zero, it's it's not really scientific because you're still gonna have petroleum sorry, not petroleum. You're still gonna have hydrocarbons, these molecules out there in the environment that you cannot identify the source of that may have a completely natural source.

And so, like, you're measuring that there's something there, but maybe it's something that's supposed to be there.

So it it's kind of an illusory standard, the idea of cleaning up to zero.

Good. I think I need more. Well, thank you. Sure. Thank you.

Sure. Okay. Thank you.

Any other questions? If not, thank you very much. Thank you very much to our testifiers. Let's move on to the next measure. Also, related to water, this is Senate Bill 3136 relating to lead materials in water infrastructure.

This amends prohibitions on the use of lead materials in drinking water distribution to align safe drinking water act and related code of federal regulations. First up, State Health Planning and Development Agency.

Good afternoon, Chair, Vice Chair, Members of the Committee. Jason Esparo with Shift Up. We support this bill because it would strengthen limits on lead in drinking water infrastructure and align Hawaii law with federal safety standards. This is important for public health because lead exposure can seriously harm children and other vulnerable people, and the bill would help keep drinking water safer across the state. Thank you for this opportunity.

Thank you very much. Department of Health.

Good afternoon, Chair, Vice Chair, Committee Members. My name is Joan Corrigan with the Department of Health Safe Drinking Water Branch. The department stands by our written testimony in support of this bill. I'm available for questions.

Thank you very much. Pika Bukowski, Plumbers and Fitters. Not present. Anyone else wishing to testify in Senate bill 3136? If not, questions?

If not, we'll move on. Thank you very much to the testifiers. Senate Bill 3154 Senate Draft Two, House Draft One relating to transportation environmental review. Authorize the Department of Transportation to assume responsibilities under the National Environmental Environmental Policy Act for Highway Projects within the state. First up, we have Department of Transportation on Zoom.

Hi. Good afternoon, Chair, Vice Chair,

and Members of the Committee. My name is Genevieve Hilliard Sullivan with the Department of Transportation, and we stand on our written testimony in strong support of this bill that authorized HDOT to participate in the federal NEPA program. And I'm available for questions. Mahalo.

Thank you very much. Greg Masakian on Zoom? Not present. Anyone else wishing to testify in this measure? If not, questions, members?

If not, thanks very much. The testifiers, let's move on to the next measure. Senate Bill 2203 Senate Draft Two, relating to law enforcement. This establishes the offense of use of a mask or facial covering by a law enforcement officer. First up, we have Community Alliance on Prisons.

Not present. Next person said they wish to testify is Nate Hicks. Mister Hicks, welcome.

Thanks for having me. Aloha. Nate Hicks with Hawaii Public Health Institute, Chair, Vice Chair, Members of the Committee. Mahalo for the opportunity to testify and support. Interactions with law enforcement can be very scary.

They can lead to injuries. Fortunately, sometimes death. And these interactions can get escalated because of these fears, these issues that people have with law enforcement. And I think making sure that people can see the person that they're dealing with, see their face can alleviate some of these concerns, alleviate some of these fears, whether that person is actually who they say they are. And so making sure that we have a safe environment in dealing with law enforcement I think is incredibly important.

So ask that you pass this bill. Mahalo.

Thank you very much. Tina Sablan, legal clinic on Zoom. Please proceed, Miss Sablan.

Hello? Hello? Hello?

Just turn, if you could turn off your speaker. Turn off your speaker, then it might not have that echo. Please proceed. We'll come back.

Okay. Okay. Oh, no. No.

You still haven't. If you could turn off your speaker, turn your microphone on, put your speaker off.

Okay. How's that?

Good. Please proceed. Your video is not on, but that's okay.

Just go ahead anyway.

Okay. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry.

No. It's back again.

I'll try to try to try to

Alright. We'll come back to you. Mandy Fernandez, ACLU. Are you on Zoom? Me out.

Hi. Good afternoon, Chair, Vice Chair, Members of the Committee. My name is Mandy Fernandez. I'm the policy director with the ACLU of Hawaii. We support SB 2203.

We, we really appreciate the work of this committee, this session, and congratulations to all of us for almost being done. I wanted to highlight things about this bill. We, of course, support it because, we've seen how much harm and how many civil rights abuses have been committed by masked agent agents, throughout the continent. We don't want to see that here. I will highlight that this only covers this only addresses masking of law enforcement, and it still contains some exemptions.

Right? So it doesn't require affirmative identification of officers, and it doesn't limit collaboration or cooperation between local and state police and federal immigration enforcement agents. So we do prefer the vehicles that are more comprehensive in that area, like HB1886 or SB3322 which you passed out yesterday. So just highlighting that this, is kind of a stand alone measure. We do support it, but it is it is a lot more limited.

And we're available for any questions. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Liza Ryan Gill on Zoom. He's not present, but she's here.

In person. You are present.

Aloha, Chair, Vice Chair, Members of the committee. We stand in strong support, and we'll echo some of the comments.

That was a big echo. Yeah.

You know? We gotta make it fun.

It's April now. Yeah. Of of both, I think what Tina will hopefully be able to say and the ACLU and just again to bring it back to this moment in this time here in Hawaii, as as folks are deploying to help families that have been impacted up on the North Shore. Many of those families are immigrant farmers. 40% of our agricultural workers are are immigrants.

I know specifically that the Southeast Asian farmers that are up there, they are, they're documented, but they are also afraid when they see agents that are coming out because there has been such an expansion at the federal level of federal agencies that are now conducting civil immigration enforcement. It's hard to know who is who.

And as we were sitting with the police commission here locally yesterday at the county level, you know, it was so abundantly clear that our interim chief of police here on Oahu, his whole desire is to create community trust and make sure that anybody can come forward and talk to a police officer.

So I think we all have a common purpose in this is to say nobody's trying to stop the feds from what their Kuleana is, but we need to make sure that we're maintaining that trust so that everyone here, regardless of what community they come from or what language that they speak, feels that they can call the police and know that it's the police that are coming to their door, especially if they're in danger or they need rescuing. So follow-up.

Thank you very much, miss Gil. We'll try again. Tina Savlan.

Yes. Is that better?

Much better. Please proceed.

Alright. Aloha, Chair, Vice Chair, and Members. Again, Tina Sablan with the Legal Clinic on behalf of our president, Amy Agbayani. TLC is a nonprofit that works for immigrant justice alongside the Coalition for Immigrant Rights and ACLU and many other partners. We provide legal services, community education, and policy advocacy.

We stand on our written testimony in support of this measure. And like my colleagues who spoke before me, we appreciate its intent, but note that its focus is limited to masking, and there are other measures still moving through this measure through the session that regulate masking as well as other crucial elements of transparent policing. A fundamental principle of policing in any democratic society is that law enforcement officers should be clearly identifiable and accountable when they're interacting with the public.

And over the past year, we've seen how mask enforcement actions really undermine public confidence and heighten community anxiety. It also has placed people at greater risk, because we've seen more mask impersonators of law enforcement, such that the FBI, as recently as October, actually issued a bulletin advising or requesting actual immigration officers to to identify themselves and and be visible because of the the the problems with mass impersonators committing crimes and assaulting people.

For the people we serve at TLC, including asylum seekers, crime survivors, individuals with limited English proficiency, clear identification is essential to safety, and officers who obscure their faces and identities without a clear necessity can really create fear and confusion and hesitation to seek help.

So we respectfully recommend that the committee consider strengthening this bill by incorporating additional elements of transparent policing that are covered in other bills, such as requiring written publicly available agency policies, clear, visible officer identification, such as badges or name markings, and penalties for violations. We also note that the prior amendments include adding exceptions for plainclothes officers that may present some implementation challenges, and so additional training and internal guidance may be required.

Mahalo for the opportunity to testify and for letting me come back again to try and get this testimony in.

Thank you very much. Appreciate it. Next, Christine Andrews on Zoom. Please proceed.

Aloha, Chair, Vice Chair, Members of the Committee. Christine Andrews, from Maui, and also the EPO Maui Coalition.

Just reiterating again that, I mean, we have had, testimony on other bills and that have more components than this particular bill but for myself as a constitutional observer where we have witnessed federal agents, unmasked, attacking and killing, people engaged in First Amendment protected activity, that the security of everyone requires that our law enforcement officers be visible so that we know that there actually are law enforcement so that people who are victims of crime can feel safe calling our local police and asking for assistance and that, people like myself who are outside engaging in protected first amendment activity, can feel safe to do so and that there is accountability if our rights are infringed.

So thank you so much for, the opportunity to testify.

Thank you, Miss Andrews. Is there anyone else wishing to testify in this measure? If not, questions, members?

If not, thank you very much. We'll move on to the next measure. Senate Bill 3262 Senate Draft One relating to education. This requires the Hawaii teacher standards board, submit three nominees of its executive director to the board of education. Board of education will appoint the executive director from nominees on the list subject to advice and consent of the Senate.

First up, we have Miss Ihiga, Hawaii Teachers Standards Board. Welcome, Miss Ihiga.

Aloha, and thank you for hearing our testimony. I speak on behalf Miss Ihiga, I speak on behalf of the Hawaii Teachers Standards Board. There's already a process in law, for the Hawaii Teachers Standards Board executive director to be appointed. Now our board is already going through the advice and consent of the Senate, which is appropriate. And all attached agencies are recommended by their governing boards, and they are appointed by their governing boards.

So this really undermines this bill would undermine the authority of the Board of Education, which actually appoints our executive director now. And they can, hire and fire. That's up to the Board of Education. And we prefer that it keep this way. We don't know why another layer has been added.

So it's all in our testimony. And just if you look at other if the I'm sorry. I'll I'll just add that school facilities authority did have, a different process. They had advice and consent of the Senate. But in 2023, it was got it changed back to the board their board appointing the their executive director.

So, we wanna be aligned with other attached agencies and we think that's the proper way. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Next up, Osa Tui, Hawaii State Teachers Association or its designee? Designee.

Alana Chen, Vice Chair, Members of the Committee, Jason Bradshaw, I'm relations specialist for Hawaii State Teachers Association. We stand in strong support of this bill. It strengthens the leadership selection process for the Hawaii Teachers Standards Board. By requiring the Board of Education to select the executive director from the list of three nominees and managing the advice and consent of the Senate, this bill will ensure the executive directors adequately vetted. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Is there anyone else wishing to testify in this measure? If not, questions. Members? Question.

Rep Shimizu?

Standard support, please. Question is,

Well, the Board of Education has the right to, not only appoint but also, fire an executive director. And so they have a skill of their own and they have the authority to do something if something is not going right. It's already in law and so they do have the right to do that. The Board of Education appoints our executive director every four years.

That term is coming to an end and then the Board of Education will decide again if they were going to reappoint or appoint someone else, but they first get the recommendation from Hawaii teacher stand.

Yeah. I'm I'm sorry. Besides that, singular duty, How of how much are they on the site and direction of communication, interaction?

I don't know because I'm not the executive director, but they do they have been called in for, I think, two different presentations at the board of education. But they are I know that they do watch and they do care, but I'm not sure of the interaction. I'm sorry. Okay.

Sure. Any other

Questions? If not, thank you very much. Let's move on to the next measure. Senate Bill 3118 Senate Draft One, House Draft Two, relating to the inter state compact on educational opportunity for military children. Keith Hayashi, Hawaii State Department of Education or his designated

Good afternoon. Ken Kakisaku on behalf of Department of Education. Department stands on a testimony in support of this measure and does appreciate the amendments in HD1 that has an effective date and hope that the bill can be passed as is.

Briefly, could you explain why you think this is a good bill?

Sure. So it's actually largely a housekeeping measure. So in the bill itself, we are just erroneously attributing to the wrong federal statute. So we're just trying to correct that, as it gets said. Thank you.

It's 0.05. Okay. Anyone else wishing to testify in this measure? If not, questions, members? If not, thank you very much to all the testifiers.

Let's go on to the last measure, Senate Bill 3250, Senate draft one, House draft one, relating to Liberty and Justice Day. Members, we've received no testimony on this measure, so we don't have anyone to call. So we'll have to wait on that. Okay. Those are all the, measures that we've had on our agenda.

I'm gonna take a brief recess while we assemble members so we can vote. Recess.

Welcome to the reconvening of the House Committee on Judiciary and Hawaiian Affairs. It is Thursday, April 2. We're now at 02:48PM.

We're on the 2PM agenda, and we're moving into decision making. Thank you members for being here for decision making. On Senate Bill 2169 Senate Draft One, House Draft One relating to the Agribusiness Development Corporation, I acknowledge that there has been difficulties with the Agribusiness Development Corporation and their work over the years. I'm not ignoring that. I'm very well aware of it, and I am hopeful that they're turning over a new leaf, all puns intended.

And that our Chair of House Agriculture Committee is determined to help the Agribusiness Development Corporation do a better job. So I acknowledge the skepticism and concerns in it of those who oppose this measure, but I

would like to give this a chance. It still has a defective effective date. I would like to move it forward as is. Questions or concerns, members?

Sure.

Yes. Rep Shimizu.

I'm, I'm disappointed that they didn't come to testify on their behalf. I don't know what are the safeguards when we turn the keys over to them. I'm gonna be voting no.

Okay. Understood. Any other comments? If not, Vice Chair for the vote.

Voting on SB2169 SD1 HD1 as is. [Roll call]. Recommendation is adopted.

Thank you. Next measure, Senate bill 2818 Senate draft two house draft one relating to voting. This is a necessary correction, and and I think we need to move it forward to conference. My recommendation is to make technical amendments for clarity, consistency, and style. Questions or concerns, members?

Sure.

Yes.

Sorry.

I'll just brief comment. I'll be going forward with reservations, just taking to heart the Maui Chamber conferences, comments.

K.

Thank you. Any other comments, questions? If not, vice chair for the vote.

Voting on SB 2818 SD2 HD1 with amendments. Representatives Belatti and Sayama are excused. Are there any voting no?

No vote.

Reservations.

Reservations for rep Shimizu. Recommendation is adopted.

No for representative Garcia. With reservations for representative Cochran, any additional reservations?

Thank you. Senate bill 2972, senate draft one, house draft one, relating to Oahu coral reef restoration. On this measure, after reviewing the testimony, I'd like to recommend we move forward with technical amendments for clarity, consistency, and and style, and put the date for the whole Holomua Marine Initiative process to be rather than 07/01/2026, make it 07/01/2027 so that division of aquatic resources would be able to reasonably begin on that date.

I acknowledge that this does not do what other, you know, testifiers have asked me to do to go back to the original version of the bill. So but I do wanna support the division of aquatic resources.

So that's what this bill would do. So it's a house draft two, technical amendments plus change the start date for division of aquatic resources to begin the Holomua Marine Initiative process no later than 07/01/2027. Questions or concerns members?

Chair, you wouldn't consider putting back the nighttime spearing bath?

I know.

Okay. That's my reservation. I mean, I think we should move it forward, but I wish we could put that back in. Okay. Reservations.

Thank you. Other comments? If not, vice chair for the vote.

And for representative Cochran.

Voting on SB 2972 SD one HD one with amendments. Representatives Belatti and Sayama are Are there any voting no? Rep reservations for rep Shimizu, any additional reservations?

Reservations.

Reservations.

And reservations for representative Garcia, recommendation is adopted.

Thank you. Senate Bill 2398. Senate Draft Two, House Draft One, relating to residential housing utilities. On this measure, I'd like to move forward with technical amendments for clarity, consistency, and style, and adopt the recommended amendment from the Board of Water Supply. Any questions or concerns?

If not, Vice Chair for the vote.

Voting on SB2398 SD2 HD1 with amendments. Representatives Belatti and Sayama are excused. Are there any voting no? No votes.

No for representative Garcia. Any with reservations? Cochran reservations for representative Cochran, Recommendation is adopted.

Thank you. Senate bill 2046 Senate draft two, House draft one, related to underground storage tanks. I do not have concurrence, to I did not get agreement from, other chairs to return this to an earlier version of the measure. And in its current version, it does not appear to be a bill worth pursuing, so I recommend we defer it. Comments or concerns?

Okay. Thanks. Let's move on to the next measure, Senate bill 3136 relating to lead materials and water infrastructure. I think this makes sense. I'd like to move this forward.

I'd like to insert a defective effective date of 07/01/3000 and and move it forward. Questions or concerns, members? If not, vice chair for the vote.

Voting on SB 3136 with amendments. Representatives Belatti and Sayama are excused. Are there any voting no? Any with reservations? Recommendation is adopted.

Thank you. Senate bill 3154 Senate draft two, House draft one related to transportation environmental review. I'd like to move this forward with technical amendments for clarity, consistency, and style. Questions or concerns? Members?

If not, vice chair for the vote.

Voting on SB 3154 SD2 HD1 with amendments? Technical amendments. Yes. Okay. Okay.

Representatives, Belatti, Sayama are excused. Are there voting No? Any with reservations?

Cochran.

Reservations for representative Cochran.

Recommendation is adopted.

Thank you. Senate bill 2203, senate draft two relating to law enforcement. On this measure, I'd like to move it forward with technical amendments for clarity, consistency, and style, defect the effective date to 07/01/3000, and I'd like to, make some changes to, this, that I'll read now, to bring it more in line with other measures that we've moved out. On page one, in the legislative findings, remove all references to federal agents and the Trump administration.

On page three, lines two to 10, replace the current definition of law enforcement officer with the definition in Hawaii Revised Statute seven ten dash 1,000, which defines law enforcement officer as any public servant whether employed by the state or subdivisions thereof or by The United States vested by law with a duty to maintain public order or to make arrests for offenses or to enforce the criminal laws, whether that duty extends to all offenses or is limited to a specific class of offenses, end quote.

That definition would extend the definition to immigration enforcement agents. On page three, lines eight to 10, replace the current definition of quote, law enforcement agency, end quote, with the definition, quote, that employs law enforcement officers as defined in section seven ten dash 1,000 re Hawaii revised statutes, end quote.

On page four after line 10, adding a definition of the term, quote, mask or facial covering, end quote, to be defined as, quote, any opaque mask, garment, helmet, headgear, or other item that conceals or obscures the facial identity of an individual, end quote. And as I said, we'll defect the effective date to 07/01/3000. That's my recommendation with technical amendments for clarity, consistency, and style.

Questions or concerns, members?

Comments chair.

Yes.

I don't think this bill is needed. I think most of the concerns that people have over masking of officers is as as it relates to ICE in the recent year. But this bill has has no bearing or influence on federal agencies or or or federal law enforcement. Our officers locally, be it state or county, don't do this. It's not normal practice.

And I do wanna quote just briefly from the testimony from the Hawaii County Police Department where they say that they respectfully note several areas of this bill even as amended may still present practical challenges. Matters involving officer identification and appropriate concealment are already addressed through departmental policy and professional standards. I believe we should give them the leeway and and flexibility because sometimes it it it might require masking, sometimes it might not.

But this is not standard practice here in Hawaii, and I feel that this bill is simply a political gesture, so no vote.

Understood. Thank you for those comments. Other comments or questions? Yes. Rep Shimizu.

Thank you for your thoughtful edits. Similar to Rep Garcia and and referring to the Hawaii County Police Department. I I I believe we should allow them to do their job as they feel they need to. I do agree that there shouldn't be abuses and, I wish there were due process, but I don't agree with this bill and I'm I'm gonna be voting no.

Okay. The comments? If not, vice chair for the vote.

Cochran.

Voting on SB 2203 SD2 with amendments. Representatives Filati and Sayama are excused. No votes for representatives Garcia and Shimizu. Any additional no votes?

No for representative Cochran. Any with reservations? Recommendation is adopted.

Thank you. Senate Bill 3262 Senate Draft One related to education. On this matter, I would like to defect the effective date to 07/01/3000 and move it forward as a house draft one. Questions or concerns, Members? Chair.

Yes.

I I wish I could side with the, the current, Hawaii teacher standards board, but, my colleagues and the testimony that I've heard, I I need to side, with the chain. So I I will be voting yes with reservations.

K. Life on the judiciary and Hawaiian Affairs Committee. We get stuck in the middle. Have to make a decision. Any other comments or concerns?

If not, Vice Chair for the vote.

Voting on SB3262 SD1 with amendments. Representatives Belatti and Sayama are excused. Are there any voting no? With reservations for representative Shimizu, any additional reservations? Cochran reservations for representative Cochran?

Reservations. Reservations for representative Garcia. Recommendation is adopted.

Thank you. Senate Bill 3118 Senate Draft One, House Draft Two relating to the inter state compact on educational opportunity for military children. This has a clean, effective date. I got the approval to move it out as is. Questions or concerns, members?

If not, Vice Chair for the vote as is.

Voting on SB3118 SD1 HD2 as is. Representatives Belatti and Sayama are excused. Are there any voting no? Any with reservations? Recommendation is adopted.

Thank you. Last measure, Senate bill 3250 Senate draft one, house draft one. Because this measure did not receive any testimony in support in either the first court first committee or this committee, I don't wanna move it out. I recommend we defer it. And if the, introducer thinks this is such a great idea, try it again next year, but this time, get somebody to testify on it.

Appreciate that. Okay.

There being no further business before this committee today, we are adjourned. Wow.